WAR Russian Tanks Rolling Into South Ossetia! Hot War!-9/22-#2534

Warthog

Black Out
Just a quick snide remark/humor here.....

FALSE FLAG!
The Russian governement spec ops "created" this conflict so Russia could go in and reclaim Georgia, and crack down on civil liberties.
:lkick:
/sarcasm off.

...oh wait thats only America..

^^;

But seriously.
This could get ugly, but I have no doubt whatsoever that the US/UN will stay the hell outta this, aside from some posturing.
IT's called OIL, OIL, OIL, OIL:
 

CygnusXI

Inactive
Croatia: "Georgia must retain it's sovergnty"
(I know I spellled that wrong lol)

....meanwhile..

FOX news is covering......
EDWARDS AFFAIR!!

Oy Vey!
:stfu:
 

Mark D

Now running for Emperor.

You can't hide a nuclear detonation. EVERYONE would know about it.

Any "normal" explosion of any significant size, will cause the "mushroom" effect. It's a function of how heat interacts with the atmosphere. Heck, a big enough fart would do exactly the same thing.

A "mushroom" cloud is not dependent upon a nuke.

Observe what just a few pounds of C4 does.

Funwithexplosives-TubeOc4small.jpg


Funwithexplosives-BeginofBoom.jpg


Funwithexplosives-BigBoom.jpg
 

night driver

ESFP adrift in INTJ sea
Anything over 500 pounds gives a VERY nice musroom cloud.

Anyone remember the live pics of Down Town Baghdad in 03???

Those were 500-1000-1500 pounders....NICE mushroom clouds.
 

CygnusXI

Inactive
Georgian Ambassador:
(Paraphrhased)

Appaling (reffering to Russias allegations of "ethnic cleansing" by Georgians)
There was no attack on Russian outpost.

Russian bombers bombing ports, and airfields.
Confirmed (by bhis sources) Bombers still coming.

Credible reports say: we are at war.

I hope that most of you if not all will call for immediate (russian) cease fire.
 

Mr. Mayor

Formerly the Mayor
BREAKING ON FOX

Reuters: Georgia President to Declare Martial Law; Russian Warplanes Bomb Port, Airbase
 

CygnusXI

Inactive
Seems Russia is using the Kosovo trick.
I expect the breakup of Georgia.
Done deal.

They stayed out of our way in Kosovo.
Payback time.
 

Mr. Mayor

Formerly the Mayor
MSNBC: Russia, Georgia troops battle on border

Hundreds of deaths alleged in region's capital as tanks, aircraft deploy

MSNBC News Services
updated 3:15 p.m. CT, Fri., Aug. 8, 2008
TSKHINVALI, Georgia - Russia sent tanks and reportedly bombed Georgian air bases Friday after Georgia launched a major military offensive Friday to retake the breakaway province of South Ossetia, threatening to ignite a broader conflict.

Georgia’s pro-Western president said the two countries were at war, while the Bush administration urged both sides to reach a truce and said it was sending an envoy to the region.

Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice urged Russia to halt attacks and to withdraw combat forces from Georgian territory.

Rice said in a statement that the United States wants Russia to respect Georgian sovereignty and agree to international mediation in a bid to end the crisis in the former Soviet state that threatens to plunge the volatile region into full-scale war. In Moscow, officials said Rice spoke with Russian Foreign Minister Sergei Lavrov about the matter.

South Ossetia rebel leader Eduard Kokoity claimed there were “hundreds of dead civilians” in the region's capital of Tskhinvali, Russia’s Interfax news agency quoted him as saying. The fighting is the worst outbreak of hostilities since the province won de facto independence in a war that ended in 1992.

The roar of warplanes and the explosions of heavy shells were deafening around Tskhinvali. Many houses were ablaze.

“I saw bodies lying on the streets, around ruined buildings, in cars,” said Lyudmila Ostayeva, 50, who had fled with her family to Dzhava, a village near the border with Russia. “It’s impossible to count them now. There is hardly a single building left undamaged.”

The main hospital in Tskhinvali had ceased functioning and ambulances were unable to reach wounded civilians, the International Red Cross reported.

"As a result of many hours of shelling from heavy guns, the town is practically destroyed," Marat Kulakhmetov, commander of Russian peacekeepers in the territory, earlier told Interfax by telephone from Tskhinvali.

Russian artillery near capital

A senior Russian military commander said parts of Russia’s 58th army were outside the capital, where fighting raged between Russian-backed separatists and Georgian forces sent in on Friday to seize it.

"Georgian troop positions firing on Tskhinvali and peacekeepers were suppressed by artillery fire and tank units of the 58th Army, which are outside the capital of South Ossetia," said Russian Army Col. Igor Konashenkov.

Ten Russian peacekeepers were killed and 30 wounded when their barracks were hit in Georgian shelling, said Russian Ground Forces spokesman Col. Igor Konashenkov. Russia has soldiers in South Ossetia as peacekeeping forces but Georgia alleges they back the separatists.


Georgia's foreign ministry said Russian jets destroyed several Georgian military aircraft and inflicted unspecified casualties. It said that Russian aircraft also bombed another base in Bolnisi.

Rustavi 2 television says four people were killed and five others wounded at the Marneuli air base.

Georgia President Mikhail Saakashvili said 150 Russian tanks, armored personnel carriers and other vehicles had entered South Ossetia from neighboring Russia.

“Russia is fighting a war with us in our own territory,” Saakashvili told CNN, calling on Washington to help.

A White House spokesman said that President Bush and Russian Prime Minister Vladimir Putin had discussed the situation in Beijing, where both are attending the Olympic Games.

Bush later pledged U.S. support for Georgia's territorial integrity. "I want to reiterate on his behalf that the United States supports Georgia's territorial integrity and we call for an immediate cease-fire," White House spokeswoman Dana Perino said.

"We urge all parties, Georgians, South Ossetians and Russians, to de-escalate the tension and avoid conflict," she added.

Lavrov accused Georgia of driving people from their homes. “We are receiving reports that a policy of ethnic cleansing was being conducted in villages in South Ossetia, the number of refugees is climbing, the panic is growing, people are trying to save their lives,” he said.

Georgia has allied itself with the West and is pushing for membership in NATO, a bid strongly backed by the Bush administration. It lies at the heart of a region emerging as a vital energy transit route.

Diplomats called for another emergency session of the United Nations Security Council, its second since early Friday morning seeking to prevent an all-out war.

World distracted by Olympics?

The fighting broke out when much of the world’s attention was focused on the start of the Olympic Games and many leaders were on their way to Beijing.

The timing suggests Saakashvili may have been counting on surprise to fulfill his longtime pledge to wrest back control of South Ossetia — a key to his hold on power.

Saakashvili agreed the timing was not coincidental, but accused Russia of being the aggressor. “Most decision makers have gone for the holidays,” he told CNN. “Brilliant moment to attack a small country.”

Speaking earlier on Georgian television, Saakashvili accused Russia of sending aircraft to bomb Georgian territory, which Russia denied.

Putin did, however, warn that the Georgian attack would draw retaliation and his defense ministry pledged to protect South Ossetians, most of whom have Russian citizenship.

Georgia, which borders the Black Sea between Turkey and Russia, was ruled by Moscow for most of the two centuries preceding the breakup of the Soviet Union. The country has angered Russia by seeking NATO membership — a bid Moscow regards as part of a Western effort to weaken its influence in the region.

Georgia also has about 2,000 troops in Iraq, making it the third-largest contributor to coalition forces after the United States and Britain. On Friday, it said it would redeploy 1,000 of those troops to South Ossetia.


Georgia’s president said Russian aircraft bombed several Georgian villages and other civilian facilities.

“A full-scale aggression has been launched against Georgia,” Saakashvili said in a televised statement. He also announced a full military mobilization with reservists being called into action.

Seven civilians were wounded when three Russian Su-24 jet bombers flew into Georgia and bombed the town of Gori and the villages of Kareli and Variani, Deputy Interior Minister Eka Sguladze said at a briefing.

She said that four Russian jets later bombed Gori, the hometown of Soviet dictator Josef Stalin, but that raid didn’t cause any casualties.

Some villagers fled into Russia.

“I saw them (the Georgians) shelling my village,” said Maria, who gave only her first name. She said she and other villagers spent the night in a field and then fled toward the Russian border as the fighting escalated.

Russian official criticizes ‘dirty adventure’

A senior Russian diplomat in charge of the South Ossetian conflict, Yuri Popov, dismissed the Georgian claims of Russian bombings as misinformation, the RIA-Novosti news agency reported.

Russia’s defense ministry denounced the Georgian attack as a “dirty adventure.”

“Blood shed in South Ossetia will weigh on their conscience,” the ministry said in a statement posted on its Web site. “We will protect our peacekeepers and Russian citizens,” it said without elaboration.

Russia’s President Dmitry Medvedev later chaired a session of his Security Council in the Kremlin, vowing that Moscow will protect Russian citizens.

“In accordance with the constitution and federal law, I, as president of Russia, am obliged to protect lives and dignity of Russian citizens wherever they are located,” Medvedev said, according to Russian news reports. “We won’t allow the death of our compatriots to go unpunished.”

Saakashvili long has pledged to restore Tbilisi’s rule over South Ossetia and another breakaway province, Abkhazia. Both regions have run their own affairs without international recognition since splitting from Georgia in the early 1990s and built up ties with Moscow.

Worsening relations

Relations between Georgia and Russia worsened notably this year as Georgia pushed to join NATO and Russia dispatched additional peacekeeper forces to Abkhazia.

The Georgian attack came just hours after Saakashvili announced a unilateral cease-fire in a television broadcast late Thursday in which he also urged South Ossetian separatist leaders to enter talks on resolving the conflict.

Georgian officials later blamed South Ossetian separatists for thwarting the cease-fire by shelling Georgian villages in the area.

The Associated Press and Reuters contributed to this report.

URL: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/26080747/

par2098765.standard.jpg

A Russian fighter jet fires on a Georgian position near Tskhinvali on Friday.
 

Mr. Mayor

Formerly the Mayor
Gotta love CNN. I receive their breaking news updates (which are always so late they are never breaking anything). This is what I just received:

CNN BREAKING NEWS - Former senator and presidential candidate John Edwards, in a written statement, admits to an extramarital affair in 2006.

First of all, who gives a s***. :stfu:

Second, it is NOT breaking. The National Enquirer :kk2:broke this last week, I believe.

Third, NO breaking news on the flareup in Georgia. :boohoo:

BUT I am sure we will receive another hour-long special on the missing little Caylee
main_hdr.jpg

Sleep well tonight, sheeple, the world is safe....
 

expose'

The Pulse......
:rolleyes: Isn't this the same crap Russia pulled with Chechnya?

Going in and starting a conflict then blaming the Chechens for starting it?
That seems to be their standard game plan. Always blame your victim of being the aggressor. Must be in the "play book" somehwere..;)

Anyway - it's good to know this is their tactic for future reference. Russia has been rattling their sabers everywhere lately...Who knows when and where they will launch another conflict and try to blame the victim...:shr: Maybe in the Arctic?...:whistle:
 

Mr. Mayor

Formerly the Mayor
FROM ITAR-TASS: 12 Russian peacekeepers dead, 50 wounded in S-Ossetia

MOSOW, August 8 (Itar-Tass) -- Twelve Russian peacekeepers died and 50 were injured in South Ossetia, Russian Army Assistant Commander Col. Igor Konashenkov told Itar-Tass with the reference to updated information.

“Two servicemen died because of the impossibility to take them to North Ossetia and give skilled medical aid, in addition to the ten previous deaths,” he said.

In his words, about 50 Russian peacekeepers were injured in Georgian gunfire.

http://www.itar-tass.com/eng/level2.html?NewsID=12937482&PageNum=0
 

Jean B

Veteran Member
I just had the radio on and they said one or two general sentences like it was nothing and went straight to the John Edward saga. Total nuts that our media is so lame.
 

Mr. Mayor

Formerly the Mayor
PRAVDA: Georgia's Saakashvili commits war crimes against humanity

A surprise military offensive by Georgia, a staunch U.S. ally, to retake the breakaway province of South Ossetia reportedly killed hundreds of people Friday, triggering a ferocious counterattack from Russia that threatened to plunge the region into full-scale war.

Moscow, which has close ties to South Ossetia, sent a column of tanks rolling into South Ossetia and reportedly attacked two Georgian air bases as it moved to assert itself as the dominant regional power.

As night fell, there were wildly conflicting claims as to who held the battlefield advantage.

Georgian President Mikhail Saakashvili said "Georgian military forces completely control all the territory of South Ossetia" except for a northern section adjacent to Russia. But Russian news agencies cited a Russian military official as saying heavy fighting was under way on the outskirts of the regional capital.

Witnesses said the South Ossetian capital, Tskhinvali, was devastated.

"We lost our city ... The Georgians are like Nazis, they are killing civilians, women and children with heavy artillery and rockets," said 28-year-old Sarmat Laliyev, a Tskhinvali resident who had fled to Dzhava, a village near the border with Russia.

The fighting broke out as much of the world's attention was focused on the start of the Olympic Games and many leaders, including Russia's Prime Minister Vladimir Putin and President Bush, were in Beijing.

The timing suggests Saakashvili may have been counting on surprise to fulfill his longtime pledge to wrest back control of South Ossetia _ a key to his hold on power.

Saakashvili agreed the timing was not coincidental, but accused Russia of being the aggressor. "Most decision makers have gone for the holidays," he said in an interview with CNN. "Brilliant moment to attack a small country."

Diplomats issued a flurry of statements calling on both sides to halt the fighting, but with no immediate effect. It was unclear what might persuade either side to stop shooting. Both claim the battle started after the other side violated a cease-fire that had been declared just hours earlier after a week of sporadic clashes.

The United States was sending its top Caucasus envoy, Deputy Assistant Secretary of State Matthew Bryza, to the region to try to end the bloodshed.

Russia, which has granted citizenship to most of the region's residents, appeared to lay much of the responsibility for ending the fighting on Washington.

In a telephone conversation with U.S. Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice, Russian Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov said Georgia must be convinced to withdraw its forces, according to a ministry statement.

Georgia has about 2,000 troops in Iraq, making it the third-largest contributor to coalition forces after the U.S. and Britain. But Saakashvili told CNN that the troops would be called home Saturday in the face of the South Ossetia fighting.

Georgia, which borders the Black Sea between Turkey and Russia, was ruled by Moscow for most of the two centuries preceding the breakup of the Soviet Union. Georgia has angered Russia by seeking NATO membership _ a bid Moscow regards as part of a Western effort to weaken its influence in the region.

The leader of South Ossetia's rebel government, Eduard Kokoity, said about 1,400 people were killed in the onslaught, the Interfax news agency reported. The toll could not be independently confirmed.

Twelve Russian peacekeepers were killed and 30 wounded in the fighting, said Russian Ground Forces spokesman Col. Igor Konashenkov. Russia has soldiers in South Ossetia as peacekeeping forces but Georgia alleges they back the unrecognized republic.

Georgia's Foreign Ministry accused Russian aircraft of bombing two military air bases inside Georgia, inflicting some casualties and destroying several military aircraft. Rustavi 2 television said four people were killed and five wounded at the Marneuli air base.

Russia's Defense Ministry said it was sending reinforcements for its peacekeepers, and Russian state television and Georgian officials reported a convoy of tanks had crossed the border. The convoy was expected to reach the provincial capital, Tskhinvali, by evening, Channel One television said.

"We are facing Russian aggression," said Georgia's Security Council chief Kakha Lomaya. "They have sent in their troops and weapons and they are bombing our towns."

Putin warned in the early stages of the conflict that the Georgian attack would draw retaliation and the Defense Ministry pledged to protect South Ossetians, most of whom have Russian citizenship.

Chairing a session of his Security Council in the Kremlin, Russian President Dmitry Medvedev also vowed that Moscow will protect Russian citizens.

"In accordance with the constitution and federal law, I, as president of Russia, am obliged to protect lives and dignity of Russian citizens wherever they are located," Medvedev said. "We won't allow the death of our compatriots go unpunished."

On Friday, an AP reporter saw tanks and other heavy weapons concentrating on the Russian side of the border with South Ossetia _ supporting the reports of an incursion. Some villagers were fleeing into Russia.

"I saw them (the Georgians) shelling my village," said Maria, who gave only her first name. She said she and other villagers spent the night in a field and then fled toward the Russian border as the fighting escalated.

Yakobashvili said Georgian forces had shot down four Russian combat planes over Georgian territory but gave no details. Russia's Defense Ministry denied an earlier Georgia report about one Russian plane downed and had no immediate comment on the latest claim.

Yakobashvili said that one Russian plane had dropped a bomb on the Vaziani military base near the Georgian capital, but no one was hurt.

More than 1,000 U.S. Marines and soldiers were at the base last month to teach combat skills to Georgian troops. Georgia has about 2,000 troops in Iraq, making it the third-largest contributor to coalition forces after the U.S. and Britain.

South Ossetia officials said Georgia attacked with aircraft, armor and heavy artillery. Georgian troops fired missiles at Tskhinvali, an official said, and many buildings were on fire.

Georgia's president said Russian aircraft bombed several Georgian villages and other civilian facilities.

A senior Russian diplomat in charge of the South Ossetian conflict, Yuri Popov, dismissed the Georgian claims of Russian bombings as misinformation, the RIA-Novosti news agency reported.

Saakashvili long has pledged to restore Tbilisi's rule over South Ossetia and another breakaway province, Abkhazia. Both regions have run their own affairs without international recognition since splitting from Georgia in the early 1990s and built up ties with Moscow.

Relations between Georgia and Russia worsened notably this year as Georgia pushed to join NATO and Russia dispatched additional peacekeeper forces to Abkhazia.

The Georgian attack came just hours after Saakashvili announced a unilateral cease-fire in a television broadcast late Thursday in which he also urged South Ossetian leaders to enter talks on resolving the conflict.

Georgian officials later blamed South Ossetia for thwarting the cease-fire by shelling Georgian villages in the area.

http://english.pravda.ru/news/hotspots/08-08-2008/106045-georgia-0
 

mt4design

Has No Life - Lives on TB
MOSOW, August 8 (Itar-Tass) -- Twelve Russian peacekeepers died and 50 were injured in South Ossetia, Russian Army Assistant Commander Col. Igor Konashenkov told Itar-Tass with the reference to updated information.

“Two servicemen died because of the impossibility to take them to North Ossetia and give skilled medical aid, in addition to the ten previous deaths,” he said.

In his words, about 50 Russian peacekeepers were injured in Georgian gunfire.

http://www.itar-tass.com/eng/level2.html?NewsID=12937482&PageNum=0

I raised this point earlier, but... how do we know those deaths weren't the result of friendly fire? Russian jets have been bombing and firing on towns in that area.

Mike
 

SassyinAZ

Inactive
Russian perspective and analysis.

http://www.russiatoday.ru/news/news/28676

August 8, 2008, 20:46

Experts argue over Georgia-Ossetia conflict

Political analysts and experts from Russia and abroad give their opinions on the armed conflict between Georgia and its breakaway republic of South Ossetia.

‘U.S. is behind Georgia's military build-up’


The U.S. is responsible for the militarisation of Georgia, providing it with finance and weapons, says Chairman of the Russia's State Duma Security Committee Vladimir Vasilyev.

“Georgia could have used the years of Saakashvili's presidency in different ways - to build up the economy, to develop the infrastructure, to solve social issues both in South Ossetia, Abkhazia and the whole state. Instead, the Georgian leadership with president Saakashvili undertook consistent steps to increase its military budget from $US 30 million to $US 1 billion - Georgia was preparing for a military action,” Vasilyev also says.

‘It’s Russia vs the west’

The military actions in South Ossetia are not just a confrontation between Georgia and its breakaway republic, says Viktor Mizin, a political analyst from the Institute of Strategic Assessment in Moscow.

“What we see here is not just a confrontation of minor republics but probably the confrontation between, I am sorry to say that, Moscow and the entire west because now Russia is basically protecting its clients and its own citizens. Up to 80 per cent of South Ossetian population have Russian passports,” Mizin says.

‘EU too weak in the Caucasus to help’


Aleksandr Rahr from the German Council on Foreign Policy says the EU is shocked about what has happened but it is very few means to solve the conflict.

“German Foreign Minister Frank-Walter Steinmeier was trying to solve the Abkhazian conflict. He proposed money to be allocated in the west in order to rebuild the infrastructure of this separatist republic but it didn’t work because sides do not accept European mediators any more. That’s because the EU is politically too weak in the Caucasus. The EU has no real economic interests in the region and it has no armed forces there. It failed in the past 16 years to develop some kind of co-operation with Russia and Georgia, or to join the peacekeeping missions in the region,” says Rahr.

‘It’s an attack against Russia’

Aleksandr Pikaev, a political analyst from the Committee of Scientists for Global Security, says since Russian peacekeepers were killed in Georgia’s attack against South Ossetia, it is an attack against Russia as well.

“Several Russian peacekeepers have been killed and that has greatly increased stakes in the conflict because, a few weeks ago, President Medvedev personally called Mikhail Saakashvili and asked him to refrain from using force against Russian peacekeepers, and the worst has happened. The Georgians killed Russian peacekeepers in South Ossetia – and it is an attack not only against South Ossetia. It’s an attack against Russia,” Pikaev said.

‘There is profound mistrust between the sides’

Andrey Kortunov from New Eurasia Foundation told RT that it will be very difficult to restore trust between the two sides.

“Militarily the balance of powers is quite clear. Russia is predominant and Georgia is not in a position to challenge the predominant Russians’ might. But the question is about politics behind it and the big uncertainty is whether Georgia is able to present itself as a victim and not as an aggressor. I think this conflict will be with us for quite a time. There is a very profound sense of mistrust from both sides and I think it would be extremely difficult to restore the situation that we had a couple of days ago,” Kortunov said.
 

expose'

The Pulse......
I raised this point earlier, but... how do we know those deaths weren't the result of friendly fire? Russian jets have been bombing and firing on towns in that area.

Yes - after watching russian and some international news stations on this conflict, it would appear that Russia has their fact-spinners working over time...:rolleyes:

It's the timing that gets me..Something is just wrong. It's too obvious.:shr: (ie; the Olympics timing, US troops training in Georgia, Georgias interest in joining NATO, etc..) I know on the surface it looks likely that Russia would pick this time to move in - but something inside just says...hmmmm.
Both sides stories seem like they are missing something...:hmm:
 

mt4design

Has No Life - Lives on TB
I agree exposé... there is a lot more we just aren't getting about this story. I'm trying to figure this out.

I want to try an analogy, based upon a US centric point of view, to better understand this.

My impression is that this situation would be like if San Diego decided it was going to become an independent nation with close ties to Mexico. Therefore, in order to "keep peace", Mexico sent "Peacekeepers" to San Diego.

The US fedgov, trying to maintain it's unity, tried to negotiate with both San Diego and Mexico to maintain it's sovereign territory to no avail. So, the US moved in forcing it's hand to maintain it's borders and Mexico got pissed off. In fact, some of Mexico's "peacekeepers" are killed in the scuffle. Then, Mexico sent fighter bombers in to the region to bomb villages on the outskirts of San Diego and moved tanks in to the region to shore up it's puppet, the Mayor of San Diego.

Is that far off as an analogy?

Mike
 

expose'

The Pulse......
:D
I love your analogy Mike!

But that's not my problem with whats going on. It's just a vague sense that all is just too scripted and timely.

All appearances show that a lot has been going on in Georgia over the past 6 months with regard to US relations - with US troops visiting for training sessions on several occasions. Then there have been deals worked for Georgia to get into NATO - and reports that it really pissed Russia off. Then Russia's public claims that the US is causing conflict between Russia and Georgia..We all know about the hefty oil connection that is in the region...
The US runs troops back to Georgia a few weeks ago - for more training...

I guess if no one would have stated that the Georgian President was former KGB - it would all sit better with me.. Can anyone verify that?
 

Lone Eagle Woman

Veteran Member
Expose, Do So Agree! This is the way it is with me also, not only with the
Olympics but everything it seems.

Now also a caller to the Alex Jones Show today remarked how Lindsey
Williams, who was on the show 7/28/08, predicted EXACTLY this thing
happening. He (Lindsey Williams) said that the price of Oil would drop
and that there would be a war / skirmish with Russia. Now this has happened
which strikes me as interesting!

I would bet that the Elites really do have their slimy hands in this somehow.
 

Warthog

Black Out
Croatia: "Georgia must retain it's sovergnty"
(I know I spellled that wrong lol)

....meanwhile..

FOX news is covering......
EDWARDS AFFAIR!!

Oy Vey!
:stfu:
Isn't that something? WWIII is brewing and our scummy ass media is covering Edwards cheating on his sick wife.:kk2:
 

johnswahoo

Veteran Member
24 hours of WAR claim 1400 lives...according to Russia Today television.....I have been watching online for about 3 hours and this is vicious more coverage of the carnage that what the American media has ever shown about Iraq....
 

Scotsman

Inactive
Aye, glad TB2K is here for good news/opinions. The TV/radio is bloody frackin' useless....

Thanks tae all who keep us informed!!!!!
 

Pass Go

Deceased
I came across this Debka story talking about Israeli advisors and such. I thought it was a good assessment of the situation. It was the first time I remember hearing anything about a call for an emergency meeting of the UN Security Council. And it's more up front about oil, oil and oil,


Israel backs Georgia in Caspian Oil Pipeline Battle with Russia http://www.debka.com/article.php?aid=1358

DEBKAfile Exclusive Report

August 8, 2008

Georgian tanks and infantry, aided by Israeli military advisers, captured the capital of breakaway South Ossetia, Tskhinvali, early Friday, Aug. 8, bringing the Georgian-Russian conflict over the province to a military climax.

Russian prime minister Vladimir Putin threatened a “military response.”

Former Soviet Georgia called up its military reserves after Russian warplanes bombed its new positions in the renegade province.

In Moscow’s first response to the fall of Tskhinvali, president Dimitry Medvedev ordered the Russian army to prepare for a national emergency after calling the UN Security Council into emergency session early Friday.

Reinforcements were rushed to the Russian “peacekeeping force” present in the region to support the separatists.

Georgian tanks entered the capital after heavy overnight heavy aerial strikes, in which dozens of people were killed.

Lado Gurgenidze, Georgia's prime minister, said on Friday that Georgia will continue its military operation in South Ossetia until a "durable peace" is reached. "As soon as a durable peace takes hold we need to move forward with dialogue and peaceful negotiations."

DEBKAfile’s geopolitical experts note that on the surface level, the Russians are backing the separatists of S. Ossetia and neighboring Abkhazia as payback for the strengthening of American influence in tiny Georgia and its 4.5 million inhabitants. However, more immediately, the conflict has been sparked by the race for control over the pipelines carrying oil and gas out of the Caspian region.

The Russians may just bear with the pro-US Georgian president Mikhail Saakashvili’s ambition to bring his country into NATO. But they draw a heavy line against his plans and those of Western oil companies, including Israeli firms, to route the oil routes from Azerbaijan and the gas lines from Turkmenistan, which transit Georgia, through Turkey instead of hooking them up to Russian pipelines.

Saakashvili need only back away from this plan for Moscow to ditch the two provinces’ revolt against Tbilisi. As long as he sticks to his guns, South Ossetia and Abkhazia will wage separatist wars.

DEBKAfile discloses Israel’s interest in the conflict from its exclusive military sources:

Jerusalem owns a strong interest in Caspian oil and gas pipelines reach the Turkish terminal port of Ceyhan, rather than the Russian network. Intense negotiations are afoot between Israel Turkey, Georgia, Turkmenistan and Azarbaijan for pipelines to reach Turkey and thence to Israel’s oil terminal at Ashkelon and on to its Red Sea port of Eilat. From there, supertankers can carry the gas and oil to the Far East through the Indian Ocean.

Aware of Moscow’s sensitivity on the oil question, Israel offered Russia a stake in the project but was rejected.

Last year, the Georgian president commissioned from private Israeli security firms several hundred military advisers, estimated at up to 1,000, to train the Georgian armed forces in commando, air, sea, armored and artillery combat tactics. They also offer instruction on military intelligence and security for the central regime. Tbilisi also purchased weapons, intelligence and electronic warfare systems from Israel.

These advisers were undoubtedly deeply involved in the Georgian army’s preparations to conquer the South Ossetian capital Friday.

In recent weeks, Moscow has repeatedly demanded that Jerusalem halt its military assistance to Georgia, finally threatening a crisis in bilateral relations. Israel responded by saying that the only assistance rendered Tbilisi was “defensive.”

This has not gone down well in the Kremlin. Therefore, as the military crisis intensifies in South Ossetia, Moscow may be expected to punish Israel for its intervention.
 

SassyinAZ

Inactive
http://www.presstv.ir/detail.aspx?id=66024&sectionid=3510203

More on the UN meeting(s):

UN split on S. Ossetia crisis
Fri, 08 Aug 2008 21:09:44 GMT

Russian peacekeepers in South Ossetia

The UN Security Council has begun a new round of closed-door talks on the fighting in South Ossetia after failing to reach an agreement on Friday morning.

The five permanent members of the council Britain, China, France, Russia and the United States convened to discuss the issue after a special request from Russia.

Russia's UN Ambassador Vitaly Churkin called on the UN Security Council to intervene to stop violence in the region, but in their morning meeting the council failed to reach an agreement on a Russian-drafted statement.

After the meeting Churkin stated that "some members of the Security Council somehow were reluctant to call on the parties including Georgia to refrain from the use of force."

Churkin called it a "serious political blunder."

Press TV's UN correspondent reports that the Russian delegation implicated the United States and other nations including the UK and other western powers for "antagonising the situation."

The British delegation reportedly told the Security Council that they would bring the issue up again "over the coming days, possibly sometime next week".

In other reports , US Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice called on Russia Friday to withdraw its troops from Georgia after Russian tanks rolled into the region of South Ossetia and Russian jets were seen overflying Tblisi in what in less than 24 hours is rapidly shaping up as a major world crisis.

A second Security Council meeting was still in session late Friday afternoon New York time.

SG/WY/HAR

and this, from the Russian media:

http://www.russiatoday.ru/news/news/28660

August 9, 2008, 1:59

UN calls on Georgia & South Ossetia to stop violence

The UN Security Council has held another meeting to discuss the escalation of fighting in South Ossetia, this time at Georgia’s request. The previous closed-door emergency session called by Russia failed to reach a decision on the situation in the conflict zone.

"This meeting has indicated that the international community and most of the Security Council members are not prepared to put up with the military means in settling those long-standing disputes," Russian ambassador to UN Vitaly Churkin said about the UN meeting held earlier on Friday.

"I hope that the Georgian side will reconsider its reckless actions in the area of Georgia-South Ossetian conflict, and for its part the Russian delegation is continuing to stay in contact with both Tbilisi and Tskhinvali and do everything possible to stop the bloodshed and prevent further casualties, especially among the civilian population, and bring the parties back to the negotiating table," Churkin noted ahead of the new UN session.

Earlier the Security Council rejected a Russia-drafted resolution calling on Georgia and South Ossetia to immediately put down their weapons. The US, Britain and some other members backed the Georgians in rejecting a phrase in the three-sentence statement that would have required both sides "to renounce the use of force." But now there seems to be a slight shift of attitudes of some sides that were reluctant to the resolution.

Speaking after the meeting, Vitaly Churkin said the Georgian leadership had lost the international community's trust as a result of its military operation.

"All of Tbilisi's actions have fully undermined the credit of trust vested in the Georgian leadership as a committed party in the negotiations and in international dealings that meet the UN principles and charter," he said.

Meanwhile, the UN Security Council is holding another session on the armed conflict in South Ossetia on Friday, Ria Novosti news agency reported.

NATO encouraged Georgia – Russian envoy

Russia’s envoy to NATO, Dmitry Rogozin, has sent an official note to representatives of all member countries in Brussels in connection with Georgia’s military actions against South Ossetia. He’s calling on them not to support Mikhail Saakashvili.

“Russia has already begun consultations with the ambassadors of the NATO countries and consultations with NATO military representatives will be held tomorrow," Rogozin said. "We will caution them against continuing to further support of Saakashvili."

Rogozin says Georgian aggression against South Ossetia is obvious.

“It is an undisguised aggression accompanied by a mass propaganda war,” he said.

Rogozin has linked Friday’s onslaught to the support given to Saakashvili at the recent NATO summit in Bucharest. At the meeting, Rogozin says, it “was hinted Georgia has prospects in NATO.”

South Ossetia close to humanitarian disaster – Russian FM

Russia’s Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov says he hopes Georgia’s Western partners take note of what has happened in South Ossetia and draw conclusions.

“It all confirms our numerous warnings addressed to the international community that it is necessary to pay attention to massive arms purchasing by Georgia during several years. Now we see how these arms and Georgian special troops who had been trained by foreign specialists are used,” he said.

The FM also accused the Georgian authorities of ignoring the UN Security Council’s call to observe a ceasefire during the Olympic Games in Beijing.

Russia is attacking Georgia – Saakashvili

Meanwhile, Georgian President Mikhail Saakashvili told CNN on Friday that Russia “is waging war against Georgia”.

He said it was in the interests of the USA to help Georgia.

“It concerns not only Georgia -it concerns the U.S. and its values. We are a freedom-loving country which is being attacked,” Saakashvili said.

Georgia has called on the U.S. and other countries to put pressure upon Russia “to put an end to a military aggression” in South Ossetia, Georgian ambassador to the U.S. Vasil Sikharulidze told the American media on Friday.

“We ask our friends, including the U.S., to be mediators and try persuading Russia to stop this military aggression and incursion into Georgia,” Sikharulidze said.

Earlier U.S. president George W. Bush said the U.S. supports the territorial integrity of Georgia.

‘Saakashvili is a murderer’

The President of the breakaway republic of South Ossetia Eduard Kokoity claimis about 1,400 people have been killed by Georgian shelling.

“It is the third genocide of the Ossetian people from the side of Georgia, and Saakashvili is the main murderer,” Kokoity said.

Abkhasia reacts

In connection with the escalating tensions in South Ossetia, Abkhazia’s armed forces are moving to the border with Georgia, the breakaway republic’s president Sergey Bagapsh said on Friday.

“Irrespective of the development of situation in South Ossetia, we won’t stop moving to the border with Georgia. Today they launch a military aggression against South Ossetia and tomorrow it could be Abkhazia. It cannot go on like that,” Bagapsh said.

Diplomatic efforts gather pace

The EU has called for an immediate cessation of violence. It says it’s ‘deeply concerned’ about the dramatic escalation in the conflict between Tbilisi and its separatist republic.

A spokesman for the EU Council said The Union’s high representative for the Common Foreign and Security Policy, Javier Solana, had spoken to Georgian President Mikhail Saakashvili on Thursday. He said Solana urged Saakashvili to show restraint and to return to the negotiating table.

Javier Solana's spokesperson, Cristina Gallach, told RT on Friday that urgent action is needed to stop a further loss of lives.

“We are extremely concerned with the latest developments and we think that it is very regrettable that there has been loss of lives. The most urgent thing at the moment is to calm the situation down,” she said.

The NATO Secretary General, Jaap de Hoop Scheffer has called on the authorities of Georgia and South Ossetia to stop the violence and to restore peaceful negotiations.
 

SassyinAZ

Inactive
http://www.presstv.ir/detail.aspx?id=66028&sectionid=351020602

South Ossetians retake capital
Fri, 08 Aug 2008 21:35:40 GMT

South Ossetian separatists say they are in complete control of the capital Tskhinvali more than 24 hours into a major Georgian military offensive.

The statement was made by South Ossetian spokeswoman, Irina Gagloyeva on Friday, the Interfax news agency reported.

"The entire city of Tskhinvali is currently controlled by units of South Ossetia's defense forces... The Georgian side is trying to regain control of southern suburbs of Tskhinvali", Gagloyeva said.

On Friday, Georgian authorities and South Ossetian rebels gave conflicting claims of full control of the capital amid the heavy Georgian bombardment which has so far killed at least 10 Russian peacekeepers.

Russian PM, Vladimir Putin

The Russian Prime Minister Vladimir Putin, who is in Beijing for the start of the Olympic Games blamed Georgia. "They have in effect begun hostilities using tanks and artillery. It is sad, but this will provoke retaliatory measures."

"We cannot allow the deaths of our countrymen to go unpunished. The guilty parties will receive the punishment they deserve," Russia President Dmitry Medvedev said earlier as Russian tanks and troops moved into South Ossetia to drive back the Georgian offensive.

Russian President Dmitry Medvedev has also ordered humanitarian aid be given to South Ossetians affected by the conflict.

Russian Foreign Minister Sergei Lavrov pointed the finger of blame at the West for giving Georgia military aid.

"Now we see Georgia has found a use for these weapons and for the Special Forces that were trained with the help of international Instructors..." he said.

SM/WY/HAR
 

KateCanada

Inactive
This is the news coming from CTV. Man, this is scary stuff. :shkr:

Fighting risks wider war between Georgia, Russia

http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNe.../georgian_army_080808/20080808?hub=TopStories

Updated Fri. Aug. 8 2008 6:02 PM ET

The Associated Press

DZHAVA, Georgia -- Russia dispatched an armoured column into the breakaway enclave of South Ossetia on Friday after Georgia, a staunch U.S. ally, launched a surprise offensive to crush separatists.

Witnesses said hundreds of civilians were killed.

The leader of South Ossetia's rebel government, Eduard Kokoity, said about 1,400 people were killed in the onslaught, the Interfax news agency reported. The toll could not be independently confirmed.

The fighting, which devastated the regional capital of Tskhinvali, threatened to ignite a wider war between Georgia and Russia, and escalate tensions between Moscow and Washington.

Georgia said it was forced to launch the assault because of rebel attacks; the separatists alleged Georgia violated a ceasefire.

"I saw bodies lying on the streets, around ruined buildings, in cars," said Lyudmila Ostayeva, 50, who had fled with her family to Dzhava, a village near the border with Russia. "It's impossible to count them now. There is hardly a single building left undamaged."

The fighting broke out as much of the world's attention was focused on the start of the Olympic Games and many leaders, including Russia's Prime Minister Vladimir Putin and U.S. President George W. Bush, were in Beijing.

The timing suggested Georgian President Mikhail Saakashvili may have been counting on surprise to fulfil his longtime pledge to wrest back control of South Ossetia -- a key to his hold on power. The rebels seek to unite with North Ossetia, which is part of Russia.

Saakashvili agreed the timing was not coincidental, but accused Russia of being the aggressor. "Most decision makers have gone for the holidays," he told CNN. "Brilliant moment to attack a small country."

Diplomats issued a flurry of statements calling on both sides to halt the fighting and called for another emergency session of the UN Security Council, its second since early Friday morning seeking to prevent an all-out war.

U.S. Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice urged Russia to halt aircraft and missile attacks and withdraw combat forces from Georgian territory. Rice said the United States wants Russia to respect Georgian sovereignty and agree to international mediation.

Foreign Affairs Minister David Emerson said Canada is "gravely concerned" about the violence in South Ossetia "and we deplore the casualties that have resulted."

"We call for an immediate halt to the hostilities and strongly urge all parties involved to display restraint in words and deeds, and to respect national boundaries," Emerson said in a statement that calls for "a peaceful resolution of the conflict."

As night fell, there were conflicting claims as to who held the battlefield advantage.

Saakashvili said "Georgian military forces completely control all the territory of South Ossetia" except for a northern section adjacent to Russia. But Russian news agencies cited a Russian military official as saying heavy fighting was under way on the outskirts of the regional capital.

It was unclear what might persuade either side to stop shooting. Both claim the battle started after the other side violated a ceasefire that had been declared just hours earlier after a week of sporadic clashes.

The United States was sending in its top Caucasus envoy, Deputy Assistant Secretary of State Matthew Bryza, to try to end the bloodshed.

It was the worst outbreak of hostilities since the province won de facto independence in a war against Georgia that ended in 1992. Russian troops went in as peacekeepers but Georgia alleges they now back the separatists.

Russia, which has granted citizenship to most of the region's residents, appeared to lay much of the responsibility for ending the fighting on Washington.

In a telephone conversation with Rice, Russian Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov said Georgia must be convinced to withdraw its forces, according to a ministry statement.

Georgia, which borders the Black Sea between Turkey and Russia, was ruled by Moscow for most of the two centuries preceding the breakup of the Soviet Union. Georgia has angered Russia by seeking NATO membership -- a bid Moscow regards as part of a western effort to weaken its influence in the region.

Saakashvili long has pledged to restore Tbilisi's rule over South Ossetia and another breakaway province, Abkhazia. Both regions have run their own affairs without international recognition since splitting from Georgia in the early 1990s and have built up ties with Moscow.

Georgia has about 2,000 troops in Iraq, making it the third-largest contributor to coalition forces after the U.S. and Britain. But Saakashvili told CNN the troops would be called home Saturday in the face of the South Ossetia fighting.

A senior U.S. defence official said Georgian authorities have asked the United States for help getting their troops out of Iraq.

Georgia's Foreign Ministry accused Russian aircraft of bombing two military air bases inside Georgia, inflicting some casualties and destroying several military aircraft. Rustavi 2 television said four people were killed and five wounded at the Marneuli air base.

Twelve Russian troops were killed and 30 wounded in the fighting, said Russian Ground Forces spokesman Col. Igor Konashenkov.

Russia's Defence Ministry said it was sending in reinforcements for its troops in the province, and Russian state television and Georgian officials reported a convoy of tanks had crossed the border. The convoy was expected to reach the provincial capital, Tskhinvali, by evening, Channel One television said.

"We are facing Russian aggression," said Georgia's Security Council chief Kakha Lomaya. "They have sent in their troops and weapons and they are bombing our towns."
 

Marthanoir

TB Fanatic
News http://www.russiatoday.com/news/news/28686
Send to friend | Print version August 9, 2008, 2:46
Fighting resumed in South Ossetia
Fighting has been raging for more than 24 hours in Georgia's breakaway republic of South Ossetia. There have been reports Georgia resumes intensive fire on Tskhinvali's residential quarters. Meanwhile, several Georgian towns and cities are said to have been hit.

South Ossetian forces are claiming to have shot down a Georgian fighter plane. A jet was downed by the republics air defences, near the capital Tskhinvali. The fate of the aircraft's pilot is not yet known.

Clashes continue in the capital's region, where a significant part of the city is said to have been destroyed.

South Ossetian authorities say Tbilisi's actions amount to genocide against the residents of the republic. Tskhinvali is said to be laying in ruins, and five villages have been razed to the ground.

Russia and the international community has callled on Georgia to pull its troops out of the region. Russian president Dmitry Medvedev says Moscow will take appropriate political and military measures to stop the violence in South Ossetia:

"The situation reached the point that Georgian peacekeepers have been shooting at Russian peacekeepers. Now women, children and old people are dying in South Ossetia - most of them are citizens of the Russian Federation. According to the constitution, I, as the President of the Russian Federation, must protect lives and the dignity of Russian citizens wherever they are. Those responsible for the deaths of our citizens will be punished".

Residents of the South Ossetian Capital of Tshinvali are said to be experiencing shortages of medicine and water, while most of the communication networks of the city have been destroyed. Russian peacekeepers are assisting locals who remain in the area.

The Russian Emergency Ministry has sent a mobile hospital to North Ossetia where thousands of refugees have fled from South Ossetia. The Russian President has ordered the government to take urgent measures to provide humanitarian aid to those leaving the conflict zone. However, moving the wounded and other civilians is said to be difficult at the moment.

Another of Georgia's breakaway republic's, Abkhazia, says Georgia is building-up its military across the Abkhazian border. Earlier, the republic's president Sergey Bagapsh expressed his readiness to help South Ossetia.
 

SassyinAZ

Inactive
http://cnn.site.printthis.clickabil...ssetia/index.html#cnnSTCText&partnerID=211911

Fighting with Russia spreads to cities across Georgia

NEW: Declaration of martial law imminent in Georgia, official says

Cities across Georgia being bombed early Saturday

Russian forces moved Friday into breakaway Georgia region of South Ossetia

Georgia sent troops into South Ossetia on Thursday to clamp down on separatists


TBLISI, Georgia (CNN) -- Bombs rocked Tbilisi early Saturday morning as the fight between Georgia and Russia over a breakaway region intensified and moved into the Georgian capital.

Government buildings, including the Parliament, were evacuated when the bombs fell.

A declaration of martial law was likely within hours, Georgia National Security Council secretary Alexander Lomaia said.

Heavy casualties have reported on both sides since Russian forces moved Friday into South Ossetia, a pro-Russian autonomous region of Georgia.

Georgia's ambassador to the United Nations, Irakali Alasania, said during a special session of the Security Council that the foreign minister had informed him of bombs falling on the Black Sea port of Poti and the Viziani airfield near Tbilisi early Saturday.

Georgian television reported that the port had been destroyed.

Georgia, a former Soviet state, sent troops into South Ossetia on Thursday, aiming to crack down on the separatists, who want independence or unification with North Ossetia, which is in Russia. Russia responded Friday, sending troops into the Georgian province where it had peacekeepers stationed.

"I saw bodies lying on the streets, around ruined buildings, in cars," Lyudmila Ostayeva, a resident of the South Ossetia capital, Tskhinvali, told The Associated Press on Friday.

"It's impossible to count them now. There is hardly a single building left undamaged," she said after fleeing to a village near the Russian border, AP reported.

"They are killing civilians, women and children, with heavy artillery and rockets," Sarmat Laliyev, 28, told AP.


One U.S. State Department official called the conflict a "very dangerous situation" and said diplomatic moves are afoot around the globe to stop it.

Georgia -- on the Black Sea coast between Russia and Turkey -- appealed for diplomatic intervention.

Georgia asked the United States for planes to bring back its 2,000 troops serving as part of the U.S.-led coalition in Iraq, a U.S. official said.

"All day today, they've been bombing Georgia from numerous warplanes and specifically targeting [the] civilian population, and we have scores of wounded and dead among [the] civilian population all around the country," Georgia's president, Mikhail Saakashvili, said Friday. "This is the worst nightmare one can encounter." Watch the interview with Saakashvili »

Russia's ambassador to United Nations, Vitaly Churkin, put the blame on the Tblisi government.

"What is going on is a massive bombardment of residential quarters in Tshkinvali and other towns, too," Churkin said.

Eduard Kokoity, head of the rebel government in South Ossetia, said that 1,400 people were killed in the province, according to Russia's Interfax news agency.

Hundreds of people, possibly thousands, are fleeing South Ossetia to the Russian region of North Ossetia-Alania, the United Nations reported Friday, citing Russian officials.

About 150 Russian armored vehicles have entered South Ossetia, Saakashvili said, and Georgian forces had shot down two Russian aircraft.

Russian President Dmitry Medvedev, quoted by Interfax, said Russians had died because of Georgian military operations in South Ossetia.

Russia "will not allow the deaths of our compatriots to go unpunished," and "those guilty will receive due punishment," he said. "My duty as Russian president is to safeguard the lives and dignity of Russian citizens, wherever they are. This is what is behind the logic of the steps we are undertaking now."

South Ossetia, with a population of about 70,000, declared independence from Georgia in the early 1990s, but it was not internationally recognized. Many ethnic Ossetians feel close to Russia and have Russian passports and use its currency. iReport.com: Are you there? Share your photos, videos

Interfax quoted the Georgian Foreign Ministry as saying that strikes by Russian aircraft killed and wounded personnel at a Georgian air base and that Russian planes have been bombing Georgian territory throughout the day. Georgian officials also report four Russian aircraft shot down.

The U.S., NATO and the European Union have all called for an end to the fighting. President Bush and Russian Prime Minister Vladimir Putin discussed the conflict Friday, the White House confirmed.

By early evening Friday, a Georgian Cabinet minister said the country's forces have taken control of Tskhinvali, Interfax reported.

The Novosti news agency, citing the South Ossetian government, said Georgian tanks and infantry attacked Tskhinvali, and "a large part of the city has been destroyed. Over 15 civilians have been killed, several buildings are on fire in the city center, and the local parliament building has burned down."

But Russian and South Ossetian officials said Russia was making inroads in fighting Georgian forces.

"Street fighting in Tskhinvali has lasted for many hours. Ossetian home guards are using grenade-launchers to destroy Georgian tanks. Eyewitnesses say tanks are burning throughout the city. The turning point is approaching in the battle for the capital city," said the Web site of the South Ossetian Information and Press Committee.

The committee also said Russian armored vehicles have entered the northern suburb of the city.

Violence has been mounting in the region in recent days, with sporadic clashes between Georgian forces and South Ossetian separatists.

Georgian troops launched attacks in South Ossetia late Thursday after a top government official said a unilateral cease-fire offer was met with separatist artillery fire.

Lomaia said Georgian troops responded proportionately to separatist mortar and artillery attacks on two villages, attacks he said followed the cease-fire and Saakashvili's call for negotiations.

Russian peacekeepers are in South Ossetia under a 1992 agreement by Russian, Georgian and South Ossetian authorities to maintain what has been a fragile peace. The mixed peacekeeping force also includes Georgian and South Ossetian troops.

Journalist Elene Gotsadze contributed to this report.

I just read that that we (USA) agreed to help evacuate and transport Georgian troops; don't know how well that is going to go over with Russia, but I can't find anything in writing yet to confirm either, though there is a reference to the request in the article posted -- was a tv scroller.
 

Amberglass

Inactive
I just read that that we (USA) agreed to help evacuate and transport Georgian troops; don't know how well that is going to go over with Russia

Sassy, Barbara Starr was saying this on CNN.

I cant find it in print and the transcripts aren't out yet...
 

maric

Short but deadly
From Jerusalem Post

US: Russia must halt attacks on Georgia

Aug. 8, 2008
Associated Press , THE JERUSALEM POST
The United States on Friday called on Russia to halt aircraft and missile attacks in Georgia's breakaway region of South Ossetia and withdraw its combat forces from Georgian territory as the situation in the former Soviet state deteriorated and verged on full-scale war.

The White House said US President George W. Bush discussed the situation with Russian Prime Minister Vladimir Putin while both leaders were in Beijing for the start of the Olympics. And Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice called the parties involved in hopes of ending the fighting and made plans to send a US envoy to the region.

"The United States calls for an immediate ceasefire to the armed conflict in Georgia's region of South Ossetia," Rice said in a statement. "We call on Russia to cease attacks on Georgia by aircraft and missiles, respect Georgia's territorial integrity, and withdraw its ground combat forces from Georgian soil."

Rice also said Russia should respect Georgian sovereignty and agree to international mediation to end the crisis that threatens to engulf the volatile region. "We urgently seek Russia's support of these efforts," she said.

Rice said she and other senior US officials had been in touch with "the parties" to the conflict but did not identify who they had spoken to. In Moscow, Russia's foreign ministry said Rice had spoken to Russian Foreign Minister Sergei Lavrov. Lavrov told her that Georgia must be convinced to withdraw its forces from South Ossetia, it said.

A US official in Washington identified the envoy as Deputy Assistant Secretary of State Matthew Bryza, a specialist on the region, who will be traveling soon to Tbilisi and elsewhere with European diplomats in a bid to defuse the situation.

At the Pentagon, a senior defense official said Friday that Georgian authorities have asked the United States for help getting their troops out of Iraq.

Georgia has about 2,000 troops serving with the coalition forces in Iraq, making it the third-largest contributor after the United States and Britain.

Defense Department officials have had some contact with Georgian authorities, Pentagon spokesman Bryan Whitman said Friday, adding that the US was monitoring the situation closely. Whitman said Georgia has not requested any assistance from the US, but he would not provide details on discussions that have occurred.

The EU and the NATO alliance also urged Georgia and Russia Friday to stop the fighting in South Ossetia and resolve their conflict through dialogue.

NATO Secretary General Jaap de Hoop Scheffer spoke with Russian and Georgian officials several times by phone urging both sides to show restraint. He planned to continue behind-the-scenes consultations, officials said.

In a brief statement, De Hoop Scheffer said he was "seriously concerned about the events that are taking place in the Georgian region of South Ossetia," adding the alliance was "closely following the situation."

In private remarks, NATO officials stressed the alliance is careful not to take sides in the South Ossetia dispute. The alliance held off on convening a meeting of the NATO ambassadors - a common response to security crises.

In April, Georgia - and Ukraine - failed to secure a pre-NATO membership deal because of French and German fears that giving both an inside lane to membership would only strain NATO's ties with Moscow.

Relations already have been fraying over Washington's plans for a missile defense system in Europe.

Moscow strenuously opposes NATO membership for Georgia and Ukraine - an issue that will return to the NATO agenda in December.

Both the EU and NATO expressed grave concern over Georgia's military offensive to regain control of the province. Georgia launched the attack after accusing Russia, which has close ties to South Ossetian separatists, of bombing Georgian territory.

"The European Union calls for a dialogue between all parties which is the only way to a lasting solution of the crisis," according to a statement issued by France, which currently holds the rotating presidency of the 27-nation EU.

It said the EU was "deeply concerned" about the South Ossetia fighting and urged "all parties to show the greatest restraint" by immediately lowering tensions and avoiding any new escalation of violence.

De Hoop Scheffer also called "on all sides for an immediate end of the armed clashes and direct talks between the parties."

EU External Relations Commissioner Benita Ferrero-Waldner deplored the outbreak of hostilities and the loss of lives, adding that the European Commission "stands ready to increase its contribution to conflict resolution in Georgia with confidence-building measures."

Germany also urged both sides in the conflict over South Ossetia to end the fighting and calm tensions, while the country's foreign minister conferred with his Russian counterpart and Georgia's president.

Chancellor Angela Merkel urged "an immediate stop to any use of force" and called on both sides to show "the greatest prudence and restraint," said her spokesman, Thomas Steg.

Foreign Minister Frank-Walter Steinmeier issued a similar appeal after Georgian troops launched a major military offensive to regain control of South Ossetia.

The Foreign Ministry said Steinmeier, who recently has tried to mediate in a long-running dispute over another breakaway Georgian province, Abkhazia, spoke by phone Friday with Georgian President Mikhail Saakashvili and Russian Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov.

In a statement, Steinmeier did not detail what was said in those talks.

In addition to calming the situation on the ground, "all involved must refrain from escalating tensions further through their rhetoric and mutual accusations," he said. He urged all involved to enter a direct dialogue immediately.

http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?cid=1218104244442&pagename=JPost/JPArticle/Printer
 

Loon

Inactive
OK, I had to goggle a map to see where Georgia was and try to figure out why all this has transpired. For others who are as undereducated as I am about this conflict I'll post this article I found that explains some of the whys of this conflict.

~~~~~~~~~~~~

foreigners
World Inaction
Russia invades Georgia while the West watches. How did it come to this?
By Anne Applebaum
Posted Friday, Aug. 8, 2008, at 6:00 PM ET
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

For the best possible illustration of why Islamic terrorism may one day be considered the least of our problems, look no further than the BBC's split-screen coverage of Friday's Olympics opening ceremony. On one side, fireworks sparkled, and thousands of exotically dressed Chinese dancers bent their bodies into the shape of doves, the cosmos, and so on. On the other side, gray Russian tanks were shown rolling into South Ossetia, a rebel province of Georgia. The effect was striking: Two of the world's rising powers were strutting their stuff.

The difference, of course, is that one event has been in rehearsal for years while the other, if not a total surprise, was not actually scheduled to take place this week. And that, too, is significant. The Chinese challenge to Western power has been a long time coming, and it is, in a certain sense, predictable. As a rule, the Chinese do not make sudden moves, and they do not try to provoke crises.

Russia, by contrast, is an unpredictable power, which makes a response more difficult. In fact, Russian politics have now become so utterly opaque that it is not easy to say why this particular "frozen" conflict has escalated right now. Russian sources said that Georgia had launched an invasion of South Ossetia, aiming to pacify the breakaway region. Georgia, meanwhile, said that its troops entered the South Ossetian "capital" in response to escalating South Ossetian attacks, which have been going on for a week—years, really—as well as the Russian aerial bombardment of Georgian territory.

But there are other players involved—paramilitaries, provocateurs, even peacekeepers, some of whom (Russians) have apparently been killed—and a complicated chain of events with myriad possible interpretations. Previous tensions—both in South Ossetia and Abkhazia, the other piece of Georgia that has declared sovereignty—had somehow been resolved without an actual war. Someone, clearly, wanted this one to go further.

Both sides have deeper motives for fighting. The Russians have an interest in preventing Georgia from joining NATO, as Georgia, a Western-oriented democracy—George Bush called the country a "beacon of liberty"—has long wanted to do. In this, the Russians will almost certainly succeed. There is no Western power that has any interest in a military ally that is involved in a major military conflict with Russia.

The Georgian leadership, by contrast, had come to believe that the constant pressure of Russian aggression, coupled with the West's failure to accept Georgia into NATO, compelled them to demonstrate "self-reliance." Georgian President Mikhail Saakashvili has been buying weapons in preparation for this moment. Those who know him say he believed a military conflict was inevitable but could be won if conducted cleverly. As of Friday night, with Russian soldiers fighting in South Ossetia—only a few dozen miles from Tblisi, the Georgian capital—it seems as if he might have miscalculated, badly. Russia has not sent 150 tanks across that border in order to lose.

Still, the bottom line is this: Georgia should have stepped back from the brink—and should still do so if it has a chance—but Russia's deployment of such a large and carefully prepared force, not only in South Ossetia but in the rest of Georgia, is totally unacceptable. And the other indisputable conclusion? Wherever the blame for this week's escalation is finally laid, the West has very little influence on the outcome. Saakashvili's appeals for help and moral support—"This is not about Georgia," he told CNN, "it is about America, its values"—aren't going to come to much unless Russia wants them to.

Everyone is trying very hard, it is true: Even as I am writing this, a dozen or more diplomats and heads of state are crowding the telephone lines between Beijing and the Caucuses, trying to get both sides to stop fighting, right now, and to worry later about who started it. Perhaps they'll succeed—or perhaps those who wanted this battle to start also want it to continue.

In any case, the time to deal with this conflict was two years ago or four years ago. That there was a security vacuum in the Caucuses; that this vacuum was dangerous; that war was likely; that Georgia, an eager ally of the United States, would not come out of it well; that a successful invasion of Georgia, a country with U.S. troops on its soil, would reflect badly on the West—all of that has been obvious for a long time. Cowardice, weakness, lack of ideas, and above all the distraction of other events prevented any deeper engagement. And now it may be too late.

Anne Applebaum is a Washington Post and Slate columnist. Her most recent book is Gulag: A History.

Article URL: http://www.slate.com/id/2197155/
 
I wouldn't count on it.
We were there for a reason. Our intel knew Russia was on it's way. I wouldn't be surprised if we have much more than the 1000 stated for the "training".

We may never get an accurate number of US troops in Georgia from the media. Especially now.

It's important to know that our troops are there right now in ANY number. I heard a General on CNN this morning state that he knows there are hundreds of US troops in Georgia for training...

Lady Expose;

The SF forces sent into Georgia were not 'students' - but the 'professors'

I'd surely hate to be the Spetnas who 'play hide and seek' with those people.
 
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Here is "some of the why" that Russia is attacking Georgia; and why she will not make any withdrawals volintarily..




Russia's `War' With Georgia Dashes U.S.-Backed NATO Entry Plans

By Bradley Cook and Janine Zacharia
www.bloomberg.com


Aug. 9 (Bloomberg) -- The armed conflict between Russia and Georgia deals a blow to U.S. aspirations of bringing the former Soviet republic into NATO's orbit and securing an emerging energy corridor linking Central Asia to Europe.

Russian tanks pushed into the separatist South Ossetia region, and Georgia said Russian warplanes bombed sites including the port of Poti and the western military base at Senaki. Georgian forces renewed shelling of Russian troops, Russia's Interfax news agency reported early today.

Georgia said 30 Georgians were killed in the violence and 70 were injured, while the Russian government said 1,300 people had died in South Ossetia due to Georgian military actions.

Russian President Dmitry Medvedev said the fighting was a response to Georgia's assault on Russian citizens and the peacekeepers Russia has had in the disputed region since the early 1990s. Georgian President Mikheil Saakashvili called it a ``well-planned invasion'' and appealed for international help. Russian Prime Minister Vladimir Putin said ``war has started.''

The conflict ``absolutely'' dooms Georgia's chances for North Atlantic Treaty Organization membership, said Robert Hunter, U.S. ambassador to the Brussels-based alliance under President Bill Clinton and now a senior adviser at the policy- research group RAND Corp. in Washington. ``You don't bring in a country that has this sort of trouble.''

Rice Works Phone

As those hopes evaporated, Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice worked the phones with her Russian counterpart, Foreign Minister Sergei Lavrov, and planned to send an envoy to broker a cease-fire between the sides. President George W. Bush, attending the opening ceremonies of the Beijing Olympic Games yesterday, said the U.S. backed the ``territorial integrity'' of Georgia. The U.S. asked Russia to withdraw its combat forces.

The European Union joined efforts to stop the conflict, though help may not be as forthcoming as Saakashvili wants in part because of European dependence on Russian energy supplies.

``Countries like Germany and France were already resistant to the idea of giving a NATO security guarantee to a country with an open dispute with Russia,'' said Dominic Fean, a researcher at the French Institute of International Affairs in Paris. ``I can't see how they can get the consensus of 26 states anytime soon.''

Georgia's Ambassador to the U.S., Vasiil Sikharulidze, told Bloomberg Television the conflict would make NATO entry for the country harder, ``but we are strongly convinced we have to continue this way and that we will be a NATO member.''

`Rose Revolution'

Saakashvili, a U.S.-educated lawyer, came to power in the 2003 ``Rose Revolution'' backed by the U.S. He vowed to bring South Ossetia and two other separatist regions under central control in a challenge to Russia.

South Ossetia has a population of about 70,000 and is connected to Russia's North Ossetia region by a tunnel through the Caucasus Mountains. Most South Ossetian residents hold Russian passports.

Georgia is a key link in a U.S.-backed ``southern energy corridor'' that connects the Caspian Sea region with world markets, bypassing Russia. The BP Plc-led Baku-Tbilisi-Ceyhan oil pipeline to Turkey runs about 100 kilometers (60 miles) south of the South Ossetian capital, Tskhinvali.

Gas Strategy

The U.S. seeks to connect Central Asia natural gas supplies with European markets, skirting Russia in an attempt to weaken the grip of Russia's state-run OAO Gazprom energy company. One planned pipeline route runs from the Georgia-Turkey border.

NATO in April committed itself to bringing Georgia into the alliance without providing a timeframe or a clear path toward membership -- as Bush had pushed for -- out of concern it would antagonize Russia. Putin has called the expansion of NATO toward Russian frontiers a ``direct threat'' and likened South Ossetia's drive for independence to Kosovo's from Serbia.

Sergei Mironov, a Putin ally who heads Russia's upper house of parliament, said the fighting is ``grounds'' to consider South Ossetia's appeal for international recognition, which cited Kosovo as a precedent, Interfax reported.

Russia hasn't recognized Kosovo since its declaration of independence.

Diplomatic efforts in the South Ossetia crisis were inconclusive late yesterday, raising the possibility that violence might spread, potentially rattling energy markets.

The ruble dropped the most against the dollar in 8 1/2 years and Russian stocks tumbled yesterday on concern the fighting would worsen.

``This could be a prolonged and bloody conflict with an unpredictable end,'' said Pavel Felgenhauer, an independent military analyst in Moscow.

NATO Role

While NATO Secretary General Jaap de Hoop Scheffer called on all sides to end fighting and hold direct talks, the alliance is staying out of the discussions.

``NATO hasn't got a direct role in the conflict in the Caucasus,'' spokeswoman Carmen Romero said in an interview. ``We don't have a mandate to negotiate or mediate.''

Republican presidential candidate John McCain and Democratic rival Barack Obama called on Russia and Georgia to halt hostilities and hold negotiations.

Hunter said flawed diplomacy was in part responsible for the clash. ``This is an issue that was allowed to get out of hand by people who haven't thought through what NATO membership really means, and on the Russian side doing too much muscle flexing over a country that is a pretty small place,'' he said.



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expose'

The Pulse......
OK..
Georgian president Mikhail Saakashvili is NOT KGB...or former KGB... as someone stated here in an earlier thread...:rolleyes:
I could find no history of anything that could connect him to the agency. Ever.
 
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