DISASTER Train derailment, fire, evacuation in East Palestine (OHIO)

Wildweasel

Wildweasel

F-4 Phantoms Phorever
SageRock said:
<SNIP>Therefore there are only two possibilities: The system did not alert anyone or the crew ignored it.

If the system didn't alert anyone then everyone involved in that design needs to be tried and thrown in prison for the rest of their miserable lives as such a trend is critical information and deliberately not disclosing it to the crew on board the train is beyond unconscionable. For this Norfolk-Southern must pay.

If, on the other hand the crew knew and ignored it because safety limits were not yet breached despite the trend change then whoever made that call is incompetent to operate a broom, say much less a locomotive.

The bottom line is that there is no valid reason the crew did not have twenty miles of fair warning in which to stop and avert the derailment and did not do so. We are now down to why did they not stop -- was the system programmed to deliberately withhold that information or did it provide it and the crew ignored it?

The entire point of a system like this is to detect incipient problems with plenty of time to take corrective action.<End SNIP>
Click to expand...
A big problem mis that the first two temperature reports were not "Critical" and there was no alarm broadcast by the detectors. Instead the reports of a car in the train went to an automated trouble report that would be seen by the yardmaster and car inspectors when the train reached Conway yard, 20-some miles from the derailment. The system would have flagged that car as requiring close inspection and the signs of an overheated wheel/axle would have been obvious.

The critical alarm sounded as soon as the car with the 253 degree hot axle passed the East Palestine detector and the derailment occurred 4000 feet later. Reports from various railroad forums indicate axle bearing failures of this type take place fairly quickly, 50 miles from normal to total failure being a common distance.

About the only thing I can see that would have prevented this failure would be to lower the temperature threshold for the precautionary warning like the second detector was close to issuing. That would have flashed a message to the dispatcher to instruct the train to stop and inspect that car.

Barn door after the horse is gone, I expect NS and other railroads to lower the threshold to lower than 100 degrees above ambient if DOT doesn't mandate an industry wide standard.
 
vector7

vector7

Dot Collector
Countrymouse

Countrymouse

Country exile in the city
SageRock said:
Fair use cited.

Karl Denninger column:

Exhibit 'A' On Stupidity


The NTSB "early look" report is out and it makes very clear that the Ohio derailment was:
  • Directly caused by stupidity

    and
  • Entirely avoidable had anyone been able and willing to perform basic math been on board the train or at Norfolk-Southern, or the system in question was deliberately designed to withhold critical safety information.
In other words but for putting people in places of authority where they had absolutely no business being, to the point that their best and highest job offer ought to be pushing a broom on a floor, whether due to believing that 2 + 2 = 22 or some other sort of insanity it would have not happened.

The hotbox detectors were working.

Here is the short-form of the explanation, then we'll get into the details:



Ok, let's dissect this paragraph.

Dynamic braking is the use of the electric motor in a diesel-electric locomotive as a brake. Instead of being coupled to the generator driven by the diesel engine to move the train forward it is instead connected to a big honking resistor (that's what that "bulging sideways thing" is on the engines; it is the housings and fans for those as, you might imagine, they produce a lot of heat when in use), the motor generates electricity from the train's movement which is intentionally dumped into the resistor. The result is to slow the train instead of accelerating it, much like a Tesla does if you have it set to use regenerative braking.

This implies that the train was descending a mild grade and the dynamic was sufficient to control the train's speed. That would be normal for a mild descent where there's no reason to use the service brakes; the dynamic incurs no wear on the braking components. And, in fact, we know the train was in control speed-wise; it was operating within the speed limits for that section of track.

While the train was being slowed via the dynamic and almost-immediately after the hotbox detector (the last one) went off the emergency brakes -- air driven -- actuated. This was almost certainly (not yet proved, but I'll bet we will eventually find that it was) caused by a violation of the integrity of the airline that powers the service brake system and runs the length of the train, quite-possibly because the fire in the axle truck burned through it. When that happens the air pressure rapidly collapses in the line and the emergency brake system actuates. The engineer in the cab can also command that and the data recorder should show this if in fact it was. We will learn this in time.

Multiple cars derailed; the probable cause was:



The wheelset in question from publicly-released surveillance video was on fire. That would be consistent with the airline burning through. The axle bearing loses its location capability, it shifts, one or both wheels on that axle jump and/or destroy the integrity of the rail it is traveling on and once the first truck goes off it drags the others off due to the ridiculous amount of momentum in the whole.

This is the very-likely set of events, and what we already knew was likely to have been the direct cause of the derailment (as I commented on previously.)

But what we now know is that the progressive failure process was detected with plenty of time and reason to stop.

Specifically:



At the first sensor the temperature was 38F above ambient.

10.89 miles later it was at 103F above ambient, just below the "stop and inspect" threshold for a differential reading.

19.2 miles later it was well over the critical temperature at 253F.

Shortly after that the train derailed.

Anyone with a brain in their head had to know that if you are at 38F over ambient and ten miles later you're more than 100F over ambient you will exceed the "stop and inspect threshold" well before you reach the next detector in 20 more miles, and if the failure is progressive, and most failures are, you will be well over the critical threshold and on the verge of a catastrophic failure by the time you get there.

You don't need to be a rocket scientist to know this -- you simply need to be competent to operate dangerous machinery with known margins which you must not exceed for said machinery to remain safe and know that there is a progressive failure showing up in the data.

That's exactly what happened and nothing more than basic arithmetic -- sixth grade material here folks -- was required for anyone and everyone who saw that data to know that continuing to operate that train was dangerous and quite likely to lead to a disastrous failure.

Therefore there are only two possibilities: The system did not alert anyone or the crew ignored it.

If the system didn't alert anyone then everyone involved in that design needs to be tried and thrown in prison for the rest of their miserable lives as such a trend is critical information and deliberately not disclosing it to the crew on board the train is beyond unconscionable. For this Norfolk-Southern must pay.

If, on the other hand the crew knew and ignored it because safety limits were not yet breached despite the trend change then whoever made that call is incompetent to operate a broom, say much less a locomotive.

The bottom line is that there is no valid reason the crew did not have twenty miles of fair warning in which to stop and avert the derailment and did not do so. We are now down to why did they not stop -- was the system programmed to deliberately withhold that information or did it provide it and the crew ignored it?

The entire point of a system like this is to detect incipient problems with plenty of time to take corrective action. The equipment was functional but no equipment can do anything about HUMAN STUPIDITY whether in what the equipment communicates due to its design or what people do with the information if it is communicated. Damn written policy and "limits" to Hades; if you as an operating engineer with two firing neurons in your head observe a condition that any reasonable person who has an IQ sufficient to be trusted with dangerous machinery is nearly certain to degrade beyond safe limits based on the data you have before you can get to the next confirmatory signaling device YOU STOP NOW AND FIND OUT WHAT IS GOING ON.

If we have people like this designing and operating our nuclear and chemical plants -- and you know damn well that we almost-certainly do -- it is merely a matter of time before one or more of our cities glows in the dark.

PRISON.

NOW.

And get rid of every single person in a safety-critical position who cannot do basic math in their head in 30 seconds in a situation like this, when you have PLENTY of warning, or who will not immediately, when such a situation exists, SHUT IT DOWN, along with anyone who puts together a system that deliberately withholds trend information that strongly suggests a failure will occur based on what it observes.

NO EXCEPTIONS.
Click to expand...
I'll say it one more time.

The ENTIRE emphasis of Norfolk Southern under "Precision Scheduled Railroading" is GET THAT DAMN TRAIN TO THE NEXT STOP ON TIME, DAMMIT!!!"

And they have POUNDED that into the heads of their current employees---that NOTHING. ELSE. MATTERS.

Not being exhausted at the end of a 12-hour shift.

Not having been on the job, continuously, with no breaks (as in vacations, rest days, PTO, NOTHING) FOR THE LAST YEAR.

NOT EVEN ALLOWED TO BE OFF IF YOU'RE SICK (You're supposed to "give notice" --first--if you're planning to be off sick. No Kidding--that is for real).

My son was saying, yes, the crew should have noticed this--so "IF" the defect detectors DID SENT THE AUDIBLE SIGNAL which alerts the crews---and "IF" they heard it (if their radio was on and functional, not just the one in the cab but the radios they crew also wear on their belts)--then yes you'd think they would have stopped.

Unless they had been TOLD to GO ON.

Which we've read --they WERE.

You see, IT IS NOT JUST THE CREW that gets those warnings from the defect detectors.

DISPATCH sees the warnings on THEIR computers, too--and my son has HEARD dispatch in Atlanta WARNING A CREW OF A DEFECT OR ANOMALY sometimes Even Before They Are Aware of It Themselves because the detector hasn't even gone off yet.

SO WHY DID THE DISPATCH NOT WARN THE CREW TO STOP???? WERE "THEY" ALL "STUPID," TOO?

Or--in actuality--was dispatch telling them, "You'd better NOT stop! Not if you want to keep your job! That train HAS to be in Conway by morning!"

I still say we MUST MUST MUST have the AUDIBLE COMMUNICATIONS between Dispatch and the crew to KNOW what happened.

Without that---it is as I said--

NS will SIMPLY BLAME IT ON THE CREW.


Maybe it 'was' their fault.

But there is NO WAY IN HELL that Dispatch also didn't know.

WHY didn't they speak up???
 
Last edited:
Macgyver

Macgyver

Has No Life - Lives on TB
www.thegatewaypundit.com

JUST IN: Heartless EPA Orders A PAUSE To Cleanup In East Palestine Despite Residents' Horrific Suffering

www.thegatewaypundit.com www.thegatewaypundit.com

JUST IN: Heartless EPA Orders A PAUSE To Cleanup In East Palestine Despite Residents' Horrific Suffering
Cullen Linebarger
3 - 4 minutes

The Biden regime not only does not care about the horrific suffering of residents in East Palestine, Ohio they seem to revel in it.

Just remember, they refused outright assistance to the town for weeks.

The Daily Mail reported Saturday night that the EPA ordered Norfolk Southern to pause the clean up of the toxic train derailment that happened on February 3. The EPA claims the stop will be “temporary.”

The EPA had previously ordered Norfolk Southern to pay full the full costs associated with cleanup.

This heartless move comes as TGP’s Cristina Laila revealed earlier Saturday about East Palestine residents experiencing horrifying new symptoms resulting from the train derailment. One person reported his voice sounds like Mickey Mouse.

Residents previously mentioned they had rashes and headaches thanks to toxic chemicals.

Thousands of animals have also perished.

The Daily Mail reported

Federal environmental authorities have ordered a temporary halt in the shipment of contaminated waste from the site of a fiery train derailment earlier this month in eastern Ohio near the Pennsylvania state line.

Region 5 administrator Debra Shore of the Environmental Protection Agency said Saturday the agency ordered Norfolk Southern to ‘pause’ shipments from the site of the February 3 derailment in East Palestine but vowed that removal of the material would resume ‘very soon.’

‘Everyone wants this contamination gone from the community. They don’t want the worry, and they don’t want the smell, and we owe it to the people of East Palestine to move it out of the community as quickly as possible,’ Shore said.

Until Friday, Shore said, the rail company had been solely responsible for the disposal of the waste and supplied Ohio environmental officials with a list of selected and utilized disposal sites.

Going forward, disposal plans including locations and transportation routes for contaminated waste will be subject to EPA review and approval, she said.

The Ohio governor’s office said Saturday night that of the twenty truckloads (approximately 280 tons) of hazardous solid waste hauled away, 15 truckloads of contaminated soil was disposed of at a Michigan hazardous waste treatment and disposal facility while five truckloads had been returned to East Palestine.

Liquid waste already trucked out of East Palestine would be disposed of at a licensed hazardous waste treatment and disposal facility in Texas, but that facility would not accept more liquid waste, the Ohio governor’s office said.

‘Currently, about 102,000 gallons of liquid waste and 4,500 cubic yards of solid waste remain in storage on site in East Palestine, not including the five truckloads returned to the village,’ the governor’s office said. ‘Additional solid and liquid wastes are being generated as the cleanup progresses.’

No one should trust the Regime’s words of “assurance.” Their actions are a major reason the residents will end up having long-term health problems.

Photo of author
 
Wildweasel

Wildweasel

F-4 Phantoms Phorever
Countrymouse said:
I'll say it one more time.

The ENTIRE emphasis of Norfolk Southern under "Precision Scheduled Railroading" is GET THAT DAMN TRAIN TO THE NEXT STOP ON TIME, DAMMIT!!!"

And they have POUNDED that into the heads of their current employees---that NOTHING. ELSE. MATTERS.

Not being exhausted at the end of a 12-hour shift.

Not having been on the job, continuously, with no breaks (as in vacations, rest days, PTO, NOTHING) FOR THE LAST YEAR.

NOT EVEN ALLOWED TO BE OFF IF YOU'RE SICK (You're supposed to "give notice" --first--if you're planning to be off sick. No Kidding--that is for real).

My son was saying, yes, the crew should have noticed this--so "IF" the defect detectors DID SENT THE AUDIBLE SIGNAL which alerts the crews---and "IF" they heard it (if their radio was on and functional, not just the one in the cab but the radios they crew also wear on their belts)--then yes you'd think they would have stopped.

Unless they had been TOLD to GO ON.

Which we've read --they WERE.

You see, IT IS NOT JUST THE CREW that gets those warnings from the defect detectors.

DISPATCH sees the warnings on THEIR computers, too--and my son has HEARD dispatch in Atlanta WARNING A CREW OF A DEFECT OR ANOMALY sometimes Even Before They Are Aware of It Themselves because the detector hasn't even gone off yet.

SO WHY DID THE DISPATCH NOT WARN THE CREW TO STOP???? WERE "THEY" ALL "STUPID," TOO?

Or--in actuality--was dispatch telling them, "You'd better NOT stop! Not if you want to keep your job! That train HAS to be in Conway by morning!"

I still say we MUST MUST MUST have the AUDIBLE COMMUNICATIONS between Dispatch and the crew to KNOW what happened.

Without that---it is as I said--

NS will SIMPLY BLAME IT ON THE CREW.


Maybe it 'was' their fault.

But there is NO WAY IN HELL that Dispatch also didn't know.

WHY didn't they speak up???
Click to expand...
The NTSB Preliminary Report already states that the first two detectors did not broadcast a warning because the detectors did not sense bearing temperatures above the critical alarm threshold. Instead the detectors sent messages to the dispatch center alerting maintenance managers that the train had a car that required attention.

The second detector reported a "warm bearing" to maintenance managers, within a few degrees of the dispatcher calling the train and having them stop and inspect the train. But it did not exceed the threshold and no message needed to be sent.

When the third detector (less than a mile before the derailment) sensed that the bearing was more that 250 degrees above outside air temperature, over 50 degrees above the critical level, an alarm was broadcast to the train crew. They responded by increasing the braking by the locomotives (they were already slowing for a train ahead) to avoid using the train brakes which might cause a derailment with an overheated bearing.

At that point the train derailed anyway. The crew has already been said to have done nothing wrong by NTSB. The detectors worked as programmed. But the circumstances found a hole in the system and the derailment occurred.

NTSB will probably recommend changing detector programming industry-wide to lower the threshold of a "Warm Bearing" so that in the future a train will have to stop and inspect a car in a similar situation.
 
RememberGoliad

RememberGoliad

Veteran Member
So, nobody needs to use their gray matter in this? If there's a long line of normal readings, then a +30 degree reading, then a few miles later on down the track, a +100 degree reading, my mind is not going to allow me to just pop another bag of popcorn and keep watching, especially if intuitively it looks like *something* is going on.

Of course, that's probably why I wouldn't last in some job that requires complete suspension of thought processes.
 
Countrymouse

Countrymouse

Country exile in the city
Seeker22 posted the article below to the Buttplug thread. Since this is the first article I've read that pretty much says for sure that it was DIOXIN that was released when da mayor and NS decided to set the vinyl chloride on fire, I thought as many as possible needed to see this information. So--hoping that Seeker22 doesn't mind my re-posting it here (with my response) here goes:

Seeker22 said:

DIOXINS released after Ohio train derailment PERSIST in the environment and collect in lipids, meaning they will contaminate milk, cheese, eggs and meat from farms and ranches​

02/17/2023 / By Ethan Huff

The massive chemical dioxin plume created by the “controlled explosion” at the site of the East Palestine, Ohio, train derailment will contaminate the food supply in ways that most people could never imagine.

Dioxins, a chemical byproduct of the burning of vinyl chloride and other chemicals, are hormonally toxic and extremely persistent. They bear a double benzene ring structure that makes them extremely durable, while their planar or flat molecule shape is a key factor in their toxicity.

We are already seeing lots of dead fish and other animals in the path of the plume, but what about all the farms nearby and in neighboring states? What will become of their food animals and crops upon exposure to all those dioxins floating around in the air?

According to Planet Waves FM‘s Eric F. Coppolino, dioxins are also bioactive. They latch onto lipids and embed themselves, passing through the food chain and toxifying the bodies of the people who consume the contamination.

Strangely, everything the media lied to us concerning the “covid virus” is actually true for chemically bioactive dioxins, which bear contagion factors such as their ability to pass through from mother to child through breast milk, or to pass through contaminated food.

“Dioxins are connected to every other toxins issue that ever lived, from DDT to PCBs to Roundup,” Coppolino explains, adding that dioxins are “orders of magnitude above in their effects.”

“Many PCBs are close enough to dioxins to qualify as such; and PCBs degrade into dibenzofurans (also called furans), which are dioxins with one molecule of oxygen instead of two. Dioxins are never made intentionally; similar toxins are, but dioxin per se is a byproduct of other chemical processes or a degradation byproduct.”

Dioxins occur as a byproduct of chlorine, which is used in many consumer products including paper and feminine hygiene products​

Most dioxins occur as byproducts of the plastics industry. Vinyl chloride, the most mentioned chemical released at the explosion site in East Palestine, is used to create polyvinyl chloride or PVC, a type of plastic used in piping.

Dioxins also occur in paper production due to the use of whitening bleach. Anything bleach-related produces dioxins as a byproduct – and dioxins, whenever released into the environment, cause major harm for many years afterward due to their persistence.

“PVC is burned in every house fire, trailer fire, car fire and in the incineration of municipal and industrial waste,” Coppolino further reports. “And when that happens, dioxins are created.”

“Dioxins are also a contaminant or byproduct of nearly every chemical process involving chlorine. There have been numerous dioxin scandals over the years (such as involving contamination of Lysol ‘disinfectant,’ Phisohex ‘antibacterial’ soap and many, many others.”

One of the most infamous dioxin lawsuits was Kemner v. Monsanto, and it also involved a train wreck, that one in Sturgeon, Mo. That particular lawsuit brought to light the ugly truth about not only dioxins but also Monsanto, which was once declared to be the evilest corporation in the world. (Related: Even indoor pets are dying in and around East Palestine due to the toxic fumes released from the controlled explosion.)

Dioxins accumulate inside the body and cause cancer and other health problems​

Neil Donahue, a professor of chemistry at Carnegie Mellon University, says he worries that the controlled burn and explosion have unleashed a dioxin nightmare, the extent of which remains to be seen.

“Vinyl chloride is bad,” he is quoted as saying. “Dioxins are worse as carcinogens and that comes from burning.”

When exposure to dioxins occurs, they persist inside the body as well. They meld within fat tissue and stay there, presenting the risk of cancer and other health problems down the road.

Dr. Lynn Goldman, dean of George Washington University‘s School of Public Health, feels similarly, but is more worried about un-combusted vinyl chloride vapors that could still be lurking in and around the blast site.

“Until there has been a thorough assessment, the soot, as well as any other materials should in my opinion be treated as contaminated by vinyl chloride and/or dioxins or other contaminants until proven otherwise,” she is quoted as saying.

In Coppolino’s view, the full toxicity of dioxins is simply incomprehensible to most people. Peter Montague, author of Rachel’s Hazardous Waste News, summarized it like this:

“How can we express this in terms that people can grasp? Let’s compare it to one single aspirin tablet. One aspirin tablet weighs 5 grains (or 325 milligrams, or 325 trillion femtograms), so to express one ‘safe’ lifetime dose of 2,3,7,8-TCDD, you would take a single aspirin tablet and divide it into 32 million (actually 32,172,218) minuscule pieces. Then one of those tiny pieces would represent one ‘safe’ lifetime dose of 2,3,7,8-TCDD.”

In other words, a single aspirin tablet’s worth of dioxin is the equivalent of a lifetime “safe dose” of dioxin exposure for 32 million people. This is a big reason why manufacturers try to avoid distilling it out of their products because they have no idea what to do with it other than to release it unmitigated into the environment.

“The reference dose for dioxin is 0.000,000,001 milligrams per kilogram of body weight per day (mg/kg/day),” Coppolino further notes, comparing that to the reference dose for cadmium which is just 0.001 mg/kg/day, according to the Environmental Protection Agency (EPA).
DIOXINS released after Ohio train derailment PERSIST in the environment and collect in lipids, meaning they will contaminate milk, cheese, eggs and meat from farms and ranches
Click to expand...



This article is the first definite assessment I've heard that the burning of the vinyl Chloride DID create Dioxin.
If so, that whole area, is screwed.

Probably PERMANENTLY.

I read a book right out of high school about a town in Italy where they had a dioxin plant where a boiler full of chemical overheated and blew up.

It rained dioxin all over the town of Seveso, Italy.

To this day, no one can live there.

And the people who did, at the time--at least, the ones still alive who didn't die immediately or within a few years from cancers of various types--still have health problems.

If you can find a copy, read "The Poison That Came From the Sky.'

It was from that book's descriptions that I KNEW what the "dust" many have reported filtering out of the air was.

They had the same thing happen in Seveso....and to several other cities beyond.

2606060.jpg

Wikipedia has an article about Seveso, which is too long to reprint in total here, but I will quote relevant parts:



en.wikipedia.org



Seveso disaster - Wikipedia ​




en.wikipedia.org
en.wikipedia.org



The article goes into detail explaining how an over-heating incident at the plant led to:


"...a rapid runaway reaction when the temperature reached 230 °C seven hours later.[5][6]

The reactor relief valve eventually opened, causing the aerial release of 6 tonnes of chemicals, which settled over 18 km2 (6.9 sq mi) of the surrounding area.[7] Among the substances released was 1 kg of TCDD (3). At the nominal reaction temperature, TCDD is normally seen only in trace amounts of less than 1 ppm (parts per million).[8] However, in the higher-temperature conditions associated with the runaway reaction, TCDD production apparently reached 166 ppm or more.[9]

Immediate effects​

The affected area was split into zones A, B, and R in decreasing order of surface soil concentrations of TCDD. Zone A was further split into 7 sub-zones. The local population was advised not to touch or eat locally grown fruits or vegetables.
  • Zone A had a TCDD soil concentration of > 50 micrograms per square metre (μg/m2); it had 736 residents.
  • Zone B had a TCDD soil concentration of between 5 and 50 μg/m2; it had about 4700 residents.
  • Zone R had a negligible concentration of TCDD or up to < 5 μg/m2; it had 31,800 residents.

Within days a total of 3,300 animals, mostly poultry and rabbits, were found dead. Emergency slaughtering commenced to prevent TCDD from entering the food chain, and by 1978 over 80,000 animals had been slaughtered. 15 children were quickly hospitalised with skin inflammation. By the end of August, Zone A had been completely evacuated and fenced. Of the 1,600 local people of all ages who had been medically examined, 447 were found to suffer from skin lesions or chloracne. An advice center was set up for pregnant women, of whom 26 opted for an abortion (which was legal in special cases) after consultation. Another 460 women continued their pregnancies without problems, their children not showing any sign of malformation. Herwig von Zwehl (Technical Director of ICMESA) and Paolo Paoletti (director of production at ICMESA) were arrested. Two government commissions were established to develop a plan for quarantining and decontaminating the area, for which the Italian government allotted 40 billion lire (US$47.8 million). This amount was tripled two years later...


A 1991 study,[10] fourteen years after the accident, sought to assess the effects to the thousands of persons that had been exposed to dioxin. The most evident adverse health effect ascertained was chloracne (193 cases). Other early effects noted were peripheral neuropathy and liver enzyme induction....


An excess mortality rate from cardiovascular and respiratory diseases was uncovered, and excess of diabetes cases was also found. Results of cancer incidence and mortality follow-up showed an increased occurrence of cancer of the gastrointestinal sites and of the lymphatic and hematopoietic tissue....


A 2001 study confirmed in victims of the disaster, that dioxin is carcinogenic to humans and corroborate its association with cardiovascular- and endocrine-related effects. In 2009, an update including 5 more years (up to 1996) found an increase in "lymphatic and hematopoietic tissue neoplasms" and increased breast cancer.[11]


A 2008 study[12] evaluated whether maternal exposure is associated with modified neonatal thyroid function in the highly exposed population in Seveso and concluded that environmental contaminants such as dioxins have a long-lasting capability to modify neonatal thyroid function after the initial exposure.


The male children of mothers who were, during pregnancy of those children, exposed to high levels of toxic dioxins due to the Seveso disaster, have been found to have lower-than-average sperm counts. This result of the underlying Seveso study has been noted to provide the most pronounced evidence for prenatal exposure to an environmental chemical causing low sperm counts.[13]....

Aftermath​

After the incident, ICMESA initially refused to admit that the dioxin release had occurred. At least a week passed before a public statement was issued that dioxin had been emitted, and another week passed before an evacuation began. Even then, the government was saddled with the responsibility of determining the boundaries of the evacuation area, and thereafter to organise the evacuation. This constituted a major imposition on the community as well as on government resources.


It was soon recognized that the factory's very rudimentary safety systems had been designed with little more than simple explosion prevention in mind. Environmental protection had not been considered. Nor had any consideration been given as to setting up any type of warning system or health-protection protocols for the local community. As a result, the local population was caught unaware when the accident happened, and thus was unprepared to cope with the danger of an invisible poison.....


Treatment of the soil in the affected areas is now considered complete, since the dioxin levels are now below background. The entire site has been turned into a public park known as Seveso Oak Forest Park. This area is permanently off-limits to development. There are two artificial hills in the park; today, underneath these hills are the toxic remnants (including destroyed houses, tons of contaminated soil, and animal remains), all protected in a concrete sarcophagus. Investigations into site conditions have confirmed that the sarcophagus life expectancy of 300 years is expected, appropriate, and required....
 
N

night driver

ESFP adrift in INTJ sea
I do NOT believe I have posted this before here.

While I have MAJOR issues with Mike Adams, THIS interview with Doc Pete Chambers and Mike Yon is POWERFUL, interesting and a MUST spend the 44:24 minutes on. (Hey, even RELIC liked it!!)

Awe hell, Brighteon won't straight embed.

www.brighteon.com

Doc Pete Chambers returns from Ohio front lines for a post-catastrophe situation report - with Michael Yon and Mike Adams

Brighteon.com is a leading online free platform that empowers free speech, allowing individuals to freely share videos and express their thoughts without any form of censorship. Join us today and be part of our community.
www.brighteon.com www.brighteon.com

44:24 minutes. LISTEN CAREFULLY to the 2 ex-Green Berets as they talk about Unconventional Warfare. They were taught how to DO this, and have started using their training to identify it out in the wild.
It is my suspicion that more and more of their comrades have started to rerun their training picking up on where we are.
 
H

HDC

Contributing Member
Here are the Lyrics to My City Was Gone. My City Was Gone - Wikipedia
Quotes from Wikipedia..
"My City Was Gone" is a song by the rock group The Pretenders. The song originally appeared in October 1982....
is best known as the opening theme of the EIB Network, an American conservative talk radio franchise that started in 1984 with Rush Limbaugh

My City Was Gone Lyrics​

[Verse 1]
I went back to Ohio
But my city was gone
There was no train station
There was no downtown
South Howard had disappeared
All my favorite places
My city had been pulled down
Reduced to parking spaces

[Chorus]
Ay, oh, way to go, Ohio

[Verse 2]
Well, I went back to Ohio
But my family was gone
I stood on the back porch
There was nobody home
I was stunned and amazed
My childhood memories
Slowly swirled past
Like the wind through the trees

[Chorus]
Ay, oh, way to go, Ohio

[Guitar Solo]

[Verse 3]
I went back to Ohio
But my pretty countryside
Had been paved down the middle
By a government that had no pride
The farms of Ohio
Had been replaced by shopping malls
And Muzak filled the air
From Seneca to Cuyahoga Falls

[Chorus]
Said, ay, oh, way to go, Ohio
 
bw

bw

Fringe Ranger
Question. I understand the train was observed on fire for maybe 40 minutes before it derailed. This was a failing bearing on a wheelset. What exactly is being suggested as the source of combustion? This is a steel railcar, no hydraulics I'm aware of, but might be. Bearings are sealed and grease packed, so once the grease is gone there's none to burn. If hydraulic oil ruptured and caught, once hydraulic pressure is gone there's no more to burn. If the tank itself wasn't penetrated, what was there to burn? Did I miss something?
 
BenIan

BenIan

Veteran Member
HDC said:
Here are the Lyrics to My City Was Gone. My City Was Gone - Wikipedia
Quotes from Wikipedia..
"My City Was Gone" is a song by the rock group The Pretenders. The song originally appeared in October 1982....
is best known as the opening theme of the EIB Network, an American conservative talk radio franchise that started in 1984 with Rush Limbaugh

My City Was Gone Lyrics​

[Verse 1]
I went back to Ohio
But my city was gone
There was no train station
There was no downtown
South Howard had disappeared
All my favorite places
My city had been pulled down
Reduced to parking spaces

[Chorus]
Ay, oh, way to go, Ohio

[Verse 2]
Well, I went back to Ohio
But my family was gone
I stood on the back porch
There was nobody home
I was stunned and amazed
My childhood memories
Slowly swirled past
Like the wind through the trees

[Chorus]
Ay, oh, way to go, Ohio

[Guitar Solo]

[Verse 3]
I went back to Ohio
But my pretty countryside
Had been paved down the middle
By a government that had no pride
The farms of Ohio
Had been replaced by shopping malls
And Muzak filled the air
From Seneca to Cuyahoga Falls

[Chorus]
Said, ay, oh, way to go, Ohio
Click to expand...
"Carry Me Ohio" by Mark Kozelek (Sun Kil Moon)

Sorry that
I could never love you back.
I could never care enough
in these last days.

Her tears fell
on her pages found me well.
On her words I don't know what
to do or say.

Wading through
warm canals and pools: clear blue.
The Tuscarawas flows into
the Great Lakes.

Right in back,
where the highway met dead tracks,
the ground is now cement and glass,
so far away.

Heal her soul.
Carry her, my angel,
Ohio.

Green, green youth,
what about the sweetness we knew?
What about what's good, what's true,
from those days?

Can't count to
all the lovers I've burned through.
So why do I still burn for you?
I can't say.

Sorry that
I could never love you back.
I could never care enough
in these last days.

Heal her soul.
Carry her, my angel,
Ohio.

Children bless,
gather round the bed, she rest.
So pull and go to her Midwestern
moon and sun.

Flashes bringing on,
my open eyes to lighting storm.
The touch of mist fell soft, felt warm
on my face.

Graven dreams,
a million miles ago, you seem.
A star that I just don't see
anymore.

Words long gone,
lost on journey's we walked on.
Lost her voices heard along
the way.

Sorry for,
never going by your door.
Never feeling love like that
anymore.

Heal her soul.
Carry her, my angel,
Ohio.
 
Mark D

Mark D

Now running for Emperor.
bw said:
Question. I understand the train was observed on fire for maybe 40 minutes before it derailed. This was a failing bearing on a wheelset. What exactly is being suggested as the source of combustion? This is a steel railcar, no hydraulics I'm aware of, but might be. Bearings are sealed and grease packed, so once the grease is gone there's none to burn. If hydraulic oil ruptured and caught, once hydraulic pressure is gone there's no more to burn. If the tank itself wasn't penetrated, what was there to burn? Did I miss something?
Click to expand...
Tons upon tons of friction?

Steel-on-steel in that kind of situation gets rather energetic.
 
rob0126

rob0126

Veteran Member
bw said:
Sparks sure, but flames? Looked like flames to me.
Click to expand...

I was listening to an interview that mike adams did with Michael Yon and Pete chambers in regards to the train derailment in east palestine.

Mike got some info from a person that had what looked like a blasting cap in his yard.(i dont remember the distance his place was from ground zero).

Michael Yon asked if he could see a picture of it, to see if it was a squib or an actual cap.
Mike Adams didnt have it.

Here is the interview. I think its somewhere in the middle of the video iirc.

RT 44:24
rumble.com

Doc Pete Chambers Returns from Ohio Front Lines 4 a Post Catastrophe Report with Michael Yon

rumble.com rumble.com

Just throwing that out there.
 
TammyinWI

TammyinWI

Talk is cheap

The Wellness Company (TWC) has pledged to offer FREE medical care & support to all Victims of East Palestine Ohio Train Derailment (Mr. Foster Coulson, Chairman, Dr. Paul Alexander, Dr. Harvey Risch,​

Dr. Peter McCullough, Dr. Richard Amerling, Dr. Heather Gessling, Dr. Robert Seik, Dr. Jen VanDeWater, Dr. Jana Schmidt); go to TWC.health/derailment and register to receive free acute virtual care​

Dr. Paul Alexander 8 hr ago

Go to TWC.health/derailment and register to receive free acute virtual care with a licensed doctor or medical provider.

Spread the word!!! FREE medical care to address the pure failure of the Biden administration and pothole Pete. Why? I have argued before it is because they are Republican voters who support POTUS Trump. Do you understand the derangement?

Remember, our Spike Recovery with nattokinase (natural blood thinner) to help resolve spike protein issues post virus and principally mRNA technology gene vaccine.

Link: https://www.twc.health/collections/covid19/products/long-haul-formula?ref=Paul

1677549783327.png

palexander.substack.com

The Wellness Company (TWC) has pledged to offer FREE medical care & support to all Victims of East Palestine Ohio Train Derailment (Mr. Foster Coulson, Chairman, Dr. Paul Alexander, Dr. Harvey Risch,

Dr. Peter McCullough, Dr. Richard Amerling, Dr. Heather Gessling, Dr. Robert Seik, Dr. Jen VanDeWater, Dr. Jana Schmidt); go to TWC.health/derailment and register to receive free acute virtual care
palexander.substack.com palexander.substack.com
 
bw

bw

Fringe Ranger
Momof5 said:
There were giant flames. There was a lot of cars with petroleum lube, and malt liquor. I'm sure they are very flammable. It had to be something like that, the fire was huge. I watched it for hours 3 miles away at my house.
Click to expand...
I'm talking about the train moving on the tracks with big flames underneath. I'm not talking about what burned at the derailment site. What was burning while the train was moving?
 
Wildweasel

Wildweasel

F-4 Phantoms Phorever
bw said:
I'm talking about the train moving on the tracks with big flames underneath. I'm not talking about what burned at the derailment site. What was burning while the train was moving?
Click to expand...
There's a good it was sparks and burning seals off the failing bearing that were exaggerated by being seen on cameras operating in night vision mode.
 
Countrymouse

Countrymouse

Country exile in the city
Wildweasel said:
There's a good it was sparks and burning seals off the failing bearing that were exaggerated by being seen on cameras operating in night vision mode.
Click to expand...
Saw the early videos--where you can see a clearly-defined white (not red--WHITE hot) circle -- the wheel was already white-hot (apparently stuck-fast and barely turning?)

Later videos clearly show FLAMES--and a lot of them.

I read earlier-on that someone explained that there was a line (not hose but a 'line') for the air-brakes, that finally burned through and set off the automatic emergency braking (in other words, for whatever reason, the crew had NOT stopped the train, despite triggering defect detectors that were detecting the hot wheel--you all know my personal theory that dispatch, under NS orders, TOLD them to ignore it and go on--but when the line broke, that superseded the crew and automatically put the train into "emergency stop" mode). I thought perhaps the air leaking through the damaged but-not-yet-severed air line was supplying oxygen to the area around the hot wheel and thus the flames.........
 
Momof5

Momof5

Senior Member
bw said:
I'm talking about the train moving on the tracks with big flames underneath. I'm not talking about what burned at the derailment site. What was burning while the train was moving?
Click to expand...
Oh, ha ha! Can't answer that one
 
D

Dozdoats

On TB every waking moment

East Palestine Residents Give Grim Update after Toxic Train Wreck: ‘We’re Dying Slowly’.

Slay News : East Palestine Residents Give Grim Update after Toxic Train Wreck: ‘We’re Dying Slowly’. Residents in East Palestine, Ohio have ...
daviddrakesplace.blogspot.com daviddrakesplace.blogspot.com

Monday, February 27, 2023
East Palestine Residents Give Grim Update after Toxic Train Wreck: ‘We’re Dying Slowly’.
Slay News: East Palestine Residents Give Grim Update after Toxic Train Wreck: ‘We’re Dying Slowly’.

Residents in East Palestine, Ohio have given a grim update on their declining health following the toxic train derailment earlier this month.

Locals in the small town, where a Norfolk Southern train derailed on February 3 causing a subsequent toxic explosion, say they are now suffering disturbing symptoms, the New York Post reports.

“Doctors say I definitely have the chemicals in me but there’s no one in town who can run the toxicological tests to find out which ones they are,” said 40-year-old Wade Lovett.

Lovett now has a high-pitched voice that sounds as if he’s been inhaling helium.

‘My voice sounds like Mickey Mouse,” he said.
[.]
“It’s hard to breathe, especially at night.

“My chest hurts so much at night I feel like I’m drowning.

“I cough up phlegm a lot.

“I lost my job because the doctor won’t release me to go to work.”
[.]
Many of them are facing health issues from the chemical fire as well as the psychic toll of their town becoming, in the words of a scientist visiting the area Thursday, the new “Love Canal” — a reference to the Niagara Falls, NY, neighborhood that became a hotbed issue in 1978 because people were getting sick from living above a contaminated waste dump.

Many residents are also complaining of mystery rashes and sore throats after returning home following the lifting of evacuation orders on February 8.

“Yesterday was the first day in probably three or four days that I could smell anything,” said Shelby Walker, who lives a few yards from the epicenter of the crash and explosion.

“I lost my smell and my sense of taste.

“I had an eye infection in both eyes.

“I was having respiratory issues like I was just out of breath.

“Other members of my family have had eye infections and strep throat.

“The cleanup crew drives past us at night and won’t even look at us.

“It’s like we don’t exist. No one has reached out to us or told us anything.”

According to an independent analysis of EPA data by Texas A&M University released on Friday, nine air pollutants were found around East Palestine at levels that could cause long-term health concerns.
[.]
According to Harvard-trained toxicologist, Stephen Lester, the hot zone at East Palestine is one of the “most concerning” he’s ever seen – and warned that the chemical dioxin that was released during the controlled burn will be embedded in the soil and water.

“Until the government takes this seriously there are going to be real problems,” said Lester.

“It’s criminal that the EPA didn’t come forward with information about dioxin and start testing for it.”

Biden and Company don't care about Americans. They're far too busy propping up their latex-wearing Tiny Dancer/ex comedian installed ruler of Ukraine.

If the soil and water in EP is in such great condition, why not haul it to Rehoboth Beach and dump it near Senile Joe's estate?

Posted by Drake's Place at 10:03 AM
Labels: biden, environment, envirotards, Fair Use 107, great success, idiot, idiots, liberal hypocrisy, liberals are stupid, news, ohio, pete whatshisname, successful failures, trains, trump 2024, ukraine, USA, zazzy, zelensky
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top