ECON Swiss to vote on massive gold-buying plan

Housecarl

On TB every waking moment
For links see article source.....
Posted for fair use.....
http://apnews.myway.com/article/20141128/eu--switzerland-saving_the_gold-5246d126c0.html

Swiss to vote on massive gold-buying plan

Nov 28, 5:46 AM (ET)
By JOHN HEILPRIN


(AP) in this Nov. 16, 2014 file photo a person holds gold coins during an...
Full Image


GENEVA (AP) — In Switzerland, a campaign is on to protect the country's wealth by investing in gold — a lot of gold.

In a test of their sense of financial security, the Swiss are being asked to vote on a proposal to make the central bank hold a fifth of its reserves in gold within five years. That would mean buying about 1,500 metric tons, or 1,650 short tons, of gold worth more than $60 billion.

If the initiative wins the backing of a majority of voters this Sunday, the Swiss National Bank would also be prohibited from spending any of the treasure, which would have to be locked away in vaults entirely on Swiss soil. The prospect risks causing a spike in gold prices globally.

The nationalist Swiss People's Party, the country's largest, has brought the "Save our Swiss Gold" initiative, arguing it will restore trust in the central bank and its paper money. The proposal is opposed by the government and financial leaders but aims to capitalize on a growing sense of caution among the Swiss about the perceived dangers and increasing volatility of financial markets.


(AP) In this Aug. 8, 2011 file photo a person touches gold bars in the gold store...
Full Image


Though the country is among the world's most prosperous, the initiative argues that owning physical gold in vaults would protect the country's wealth from trouble in markets beyond the control of this small Alpine nation. The experience of the 2008 global financial crisis, triggered in part by complex investments that brought down multiple banks and bankrupted states, is fresh in people's memories.

Jacques Mayor, a Geneva accountant, said he was wary of the idea of Switzerland buying or selling gold in large amounts in international markets.

"The last time they sold gold, we had an enormous loss," Mayor said, referring to the central bank going $10 billion in the red in 2013, when the value of its gold holdings slumped.

Despite the perception that gold's value is protected by the fact it is a physical good, its market price can in fact be quite volatile. The metal is used often by speculators as a safe haven.

Recently, gold has lost much of its sheen. Its price has fallen 11 percent since the summer to around $1200 an ounce.


(AP) In this Aug. 8, 2011 file photo a person takes a gold bar in the gold store...
Full Image


Swiss polling firm gfs.bern has found the initiative is likely to fail, with just 38 percent supporting it, short of the required majority. About 47 percent were opposed as of early November.

For investors, the vote is still too close for comfort.

"Initial market reaction to a yes vote would be a sharply higher price — a $50 dollar rise looks plausible," said Carsten Fritsch, commodity analyst at Commerzbank.

A greater impact may be felt over months, as global traders know the Swiss central bank will be a regular buyer. "It could provide the base for an upward trend in the years to come," said Fritsch.

Until 1973, Switzerland was part of the Bretton Woods system of fixed exchange rates and the value of the Swiss franc was defined in grams of gold. But the Swiss National Bank, or SNB, was criticized for holding excessive gold reserves that generated too little return. Moving away from this system allowed the bank to decide more freely how to invest its currency reserves.

Fritz Zurbruegg, a member of SNB's governing board, notes the Swiss still hold a relatively large amount of gold in reserve.

"At 125 grams per capita, Switzerland has the largest gold reserves per head of population of any country - triple those of Germany and quintuple those of the U.S.," he told a conference last week.

If the initiative were to pass, the SNB would need to dramatically increase its gold holdings, which currently amount to 1,040 metric tons or just fewer than 8 percent of its nearly $532 billion in reserves as of the end of September. Raising that to the required 20 percent of its official reserve assets would mean buying gold worth over $60 billion at current prices.

There would be the additional cost of repatriating gold Switzerland now stores overseas. About 30 percent of the SNB's gold is kept in U.K. and Canadian central banks. European countries historically store part of their gold with allies to protect it in case of war on the continent.

A gold-buying binge could also hurt the Swiss economy by reducing the amount of money the central bank has to spend on keeping a lid on the strong Swiss franc. The bank currently intervenes in currency markets to weaken the franc, with the ultimate aim of helping exporters and tourism.

Zurbruegg said the initiative to buy more gold could therefore disrupt the domestic economy. And the benefits would be dubious: "Gold which cannot be sold in a crisis no longer meets the definition of a reserve and thus offers no security at all."
 

Hognutz

Has No Life - Lives on TB
I love that one of the arguments is that it will make it harder to inflate their Franc......
 

Publius

TB Fanatic
I was just reading about this and yes the people not just the government want their money backed by gold and its going to change how things are done in europe and the bankers don't like it.
 

Dosadi

Brown Coat
Gold backed swiss francs could become THE currency of choice once the "petrol dollar" is destroyed, and that is happening.

People are waking up to the banksters, lawyers and legal systems that enslave them and allow the oligarchs to loot the world dry.

Thing is that it's to far gone, and gangrenous. The host (s) are dying, and in the end a new dark age, die off, and perhaps a rebuilding are the prognosis.
 

freemen

Senior Member
Any gold backed currency could become "the currency of choice". Problem is that other currencies are not big enough to replace the dollar. In the past the Swiss franc has had a negative interest rate (ie you had to pay them interest to hold your money in francs) when people piled into it to try and preserve their buying power. This also drove up the value of the franc and caused Swiss products to be more expensive and hurt their balance of payments. The Swiss government was trying to avoid that so pegged their money to the Euro. So even the "sound money" Swiss franc has been reducing in value.
 

Hognutz

Has No Life - Lives on TB
Any gold backed currency could become "the currency of choice". Problem is that other currencies are not big enough to replace the dollar. In the past the Swiss franc has had a negative interest rate (ie you had to pay them interest to hold your money in francs) when people piled into it to try and preserve their buying power. This also drove up the value of the franc and caused Swiss products to be more expensive and hurt their balance of payments. The Swiss government was trying to avoid that so pegged their money to the Euro. So even the "sound money" Swiss franc has been reducing in value.


Yep, cant have their main exports being to expensive...folks gotta have their Swiss Chocalate!:vik::vik:
 

LtPiper

Taking cover
Better buy up some gold this weekend. If the vote goes yes it's gonna take off!!

Silver will probably follow along as well.

On the other hand if the vote goes no look for some bargain basement prices on Monday.
 

DHR43

Since 2001
Would have been a whole lot smarter to buy 13-16 years ago, when they could buy at $300 USD/oz.

Governments typically buy at peaks, so I'd expect a 'no' vote now. It will later be a 'yes' vote when gold has rallied back to it's peak, however.
 

Uhhmmm...

Veteran Member
Better buy up some gold this weekend. If the vote goes yes it's gonna take off!! ... On the other hand if the vote goes no look for some bargain basement prices on Monday.

You have well summarized both sides of the investment, but have left out a few details.

The expected upside gain to investment today is $50, or somewhat less than 5%. The downside monetary risk is not mentioned, but it is likely greater than zero.

Support among the people is 47% downside and 36% upside. Those opposed to the measure must pick up only 18% of the undecided vote, while proponents must pick up 82% of the undecided vote.

At roughly 4 to 1 odds against, I would guess that the expected return is negative, and would counsel the risk averse amongst us against investment in gold over the weekend.
 
Last edited:

NoDandy

Has No Life - Lives on TB
Would have been a whole lot smarter to buy 13-16 years ago, when they could buy at $300 USD/oz.

Governments typically buy at peaks, so I'd expect a 'no' vote now. It will later be a 'yes' vote when gold has rallied back to it's peak, however.

True. But overall I think it is a good idea. Physical gold or silver is better than physical paper.
 

Housecarl

On TB every waking moment
For links see article source.....
Posted for fair use.....
http://apnews.myway.com/article/20141130/eu--switzerland-gold_referendum-c937a01fd9.html

Report: Swiss voters reject plan to hoard gold

Nov 30, 7:26 AM (ET)

BERN, Switzerland (AP) — Projections show voters in Switzerland have rejected plans to protect the country's wealth by investing in gold and drastically limit immigration.

Swiss polling firm gfs.bern said a majority of voters opposed the measures in a referendum Sunday.

If passed, the gold investment plan would have required the Swiss central bank to hold a fifth of its reserves in gold within five years, forcing it to buy massive amounts of the valuable metal and likely causing the global gold price to jump.

Pollsters also predicted failure for a plan to end special tax privileges for rich foreigners in Switzerland.

The projections are based on tallies provided by selected voting districts and are usually close to the final result.

Official results are expected to be published later Sunday.
 

DHR43

Since 2001
For links see article source.....
Posted for fair use.....
http://apnews.myway.com/article/20141130/eu--switzerland-gold_referendum-c937a01fd9.html

Report: Swiss voters reject plan to hoard gold

Nov 30, 7:26 AM (ET)

BERN, Switzerland (AP) — Projections show voters in Switzerland have rejected plans to protect the country's wealth by investing in gold and drastically limit immigration.

Swiss polling firm gfs.bern said a majority of voters opposed the measures in a referendum Sunday.

If passed, the gold investment plan would have required the Swiss central bank to hold a fifth of its reserves in gold within five years, forcing it to buy massive amounts of the valuable metal and likely causing the global gold price to jump.

Pollsters also predicted failure for a plan to end special tax privileges for rich foreigners in Switzerland.

The projections are based on tallies provided by selected voting districts and are usually close to the final result.

Official results are expected to be published later Sunday.

Due to it's price position, it was fairly predictable for a 'no' vote. If the price was higher, it would have been a 'yes'.
 

Uhhmmm...

Veteran Member
Well, some people anyway - about 38% in the latest poll.

The vote is tomorrow, November 30. Could someone please let us know the final percentages?

.

Why, yes, I can respond to that. The actual tally was 78% against and only 22% for the action.

The fall in gold price will be small and will have long worked its way through the financial markets before the physical markets show a miniscule sag.

For a very similar thread, please see:

http://www.timebomb2000.com/vb/showthread.php?459748-Swiss-Voters-Reject-Gold-Referendum
 

DHR43

Since 2001
Why, yes, I can respond to that. The actual tally was 78% against and only 22% for the action.

The fall in gold price will be small and will have long worked its way through the financial markets before the physical markets show a miniscule sag.

For a very similar thread, please see:

http://www.timebomb2000.com/vb/showthread.php?459748-Swiss-Voters-Reject-Gold-Referendum

World markets are unconcerned with what the Swiss public thinks or doesn't think about gold. The market is concerned with what THEY think about gold and what their fellow traders, investors and collectors think.

Therefore, no effect will be the effect.
 

Orion Commander

Veteran Member
So what happens if your currency is backed by gold? It means that if I present your paper currency to you and I demand your gold you have to give me gold. Charles DeGaulle did this when Nixon was in the White House. USA government was none to happy.
 

DHR43

Since 2001
The Bottom just dropped put- dpwn 10%!

For a little context, last Monday morning 11/24, silver was $16.30, last Tuesday morning 11/25 about $16.65, last Wednesday morning $16.60.

This morning, 12/1, silver was $15.70. Now at 11:15am, its $16.25.

No lasting effect AT ALL of the Swiss "no"decision.
 
Top