Anti-Liberal
Veteran Member
I'm about to pull the trigger on a $100 face value bag of junk silver from APMEX. If there is an announcement of QE soon what will happen to the price of silver ? Hell, silver went up over a dollar today.
PREP Is it a good time to buy silver or wait till possible anouncement of QE ?
- Thread starter Anti-Liberal
- Start date
Anti-Liberal
Veteran Member
eurozone, fiscal cliff, m/e war, possible announcement soon of qe3,
What are you waiting for? a dip to 30.00?[/QUOTE]
WHAT???.......Am I aking for too much ?
fairbanksb
Freedom Isn't Free
I wouldn't wait. Even if it were to dip it's just going to head back up. There is a chance it will just keep going up for awhile.
Vicki
Girls With Guns Member
What do those mean Moggy if you don't mind me asking?
Anti-Liberal
Veteran Member
Moggy
Veteran Member
LOL, my friend, I don't mind your asking. RSI means Relative Strength Index. When the stock moves up in price on good volume, as indicated at the bottom of the chart, and the RSI is higher than on the last upmove, it is a good sign that the price will continue in the same direction, especially when the MACD (Moving Average Convergence-Divergence) is also signaling the up move will continue.
Great Northwet
Veteran Member
Also silver has had an upside breakout above the 200 dma(daily moving average-the green line). This usually indicates relative strength and upward momentum: http://www.kitco.com/charts/techcharts_silver.html
-But not always; so be careful!
-But not always; so be careful!
securitysix
Senior Member
The only silver is the silver in hand. People have made a profit over the past but once you sell it its gone. Hold what you got like you dont. Things are just starting to take a big nasty.
It'sJustMe
Deceased
Now that Vicki asked my first question (thanks Vicki), may I now ask what a QE is?? 
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The time to buy was about 5 years ago when silver was $7
nope, now I remember.... the time to buy was about 4 years ago when it was about $12
wait no it wasn't it was about three years ago, oh heck I forget what the price was under $20?
But then again, all of us saying that were nut jobs back then, right?
ETA: Really at this point in time .... I'd say buy more prep's instead .... in the areas of water supply & water storage, food supply and alternative energy in form of solar electricity.
nope, now I remember.... the time to buy was about 4 years ago when it was about $12
wait no it wasn't it was about three years ago, oh heck I forget what the price was under $20?
But then again, all of us saying that were nut jobs back then, right?
ETA: Really at this point in time .... I'd say buy more prep's instead .... in the areas of water supply & water storage, food supply and alternative energy in form of solar electricity.
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prepgirl44
Veteran Member
Now that Vicki asked my first question (thanks Vicki), may I now ask what a QE is??
QE stands for quantitative easing.
Quantitative easing From Wikipedia
Quantitative easing (QE) is an unconventional[1][2] monetary policy used by central banks to stimulate the national economy when conventional monetary policy has become ineffective. A central bank implements quantitative easing by buying financial assets from commercial banks and other private institutions with newly created money, in order to inject a pre-determined quantity of money into the economy. This is distinguished from the more usual policy of buying or selling government bonds to keep market interest rates at a specified target value.[3][4][5][6] Quantitative easing increases the excess reserves of the banks, and raises the prices of the financial assets bought, which lowers their yield.[7]
Expansionary monetary policy typically involves the central bank buying short-term government bonds in order to lower short-term market interest rates (using a combination of standing lending facilities[8][9] and open market operations).[10][11][12][13] However, when short-term interest rates are either at, or close to, zero, normal monetary policy can no longer lower interest rates. Quantitative easing may then be used by the monetary authorities to further stimulate the economy by purchasing assets of longer maturity than only short-term government bonds, and thereby lowering longer-term interest rates further out on the yield curve.[14][15]
Quantitative easing can be used to help ensure inflation does not fall below target.[6] Risks include the policy being more effective than intended in acting against deflation – leading to higher inflation,[16] or of not being effective enough if banks do not lend out the additional reserves. [17]
More to the wiki article at the link.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quantitative_easing
Ravekid
Veteran Member
Anything can happen, and make sure this is money you can stand to lose (at least 75% of it). If they inflate the money supply and inject more money into the system, then most people will take that as a sign that dollars are now worth even less, which should cause inflation. Unfortunately, the only people really winning with these bailouts/cash infusions are a very select few. The bulk of the people won't see anything more in their paychecks, so the majority won't have additional money, which means prices can't rise that much, or those products just won't exist as people won't purchase them. They will become too costly for people to buy.
This also will signal a weakness in fiat currency, which should drive gold/silver higher, for a few different reasons. However, there is nothing that will make your silver hold the same value even after a collapse. For one, silver is used in electronics manufacturing, and part of the price of silver is due to that demand. If the economy/dollar collapses, are folks really going to be going out and buying iPhones, digital cameras, etc.? If demand for those consumer electronics takes a massive dive, what happens to the price of silver? If in addition, we end up going back on a gold standard (unlikely, as it is harder to manipulate the economy), will silver be consider a second tier standard?
Looks like you want to hedge against silver going down. Your best bet is to purchase the 40% silver halves. That way, if silver dives and the US money supply doesn't change, your coins are worth .50, not .25 or .10.
I'm about to pull the trigger on a $100 face value bag of junk silver from APMEX. If there is an announcement of QE soon what will happen to the price of silver ? Hell, silver went up over a dollar today.
"Anti-Liberal"? what kind of moniker is that?! cazart! i'm a liberal............."classical liberal", which is just a way of saying libertarian, as opposed to a "modern liberal"...i'm just pulling your chain a bit. i love talking silver trade by crackey....off topic for a sec? i wish i had the FRN's to get into a few roman era silver denarius, i find them fascinating, because as the empire started to spiral down, the silver content of the denarius got debased, a denarii being a tenth a toz of silver, the daily wage of a laborer....any way.....
this is just me, but i never felt a pull to do two things, deal with a larger firm like Ampex...nothing WRONG with them, no, not saying that. its like, you might like cauliflower, i dont...that kind of thing....and i've always being leery of buying 90%'ers in bags, simply because i'm not SURE if they throw a lot of culls, (no dates, lotta wear) or G-4 'goods', same thing, a lot of wear....let me put it this way, in my mind, they are not going to give me, the absolute best of the best...and why would they?
that said, if you feel okay gunning up for $100 face in 90%'ers, PULL THE TRIGGER, this is a bull market brother, you know it, i know it, a lotta guys know it.
can i just share a bit of my thoughts and what i like? i like Ebay....dont scream, but i like it for a couple reasons, first, Ebay is a pretty good middle, kind of like when i was trading livestock and grain on the Merc and the Board, the exchange will MAKE GOOD both sides of the trade, should one guy get snaky.....thats not the case on the futures, the way i see it, after MF Global....but in MANY dealings i never had a problem, not one.......i also like Ebay cause you can get to "know" the quality dealers, and you stick with them, plus as a BUYER, i always pay within ONE MINUTE of winning a roll. i only buy rolls, never singles. Sellers LOVE YOU, when you pay immediately, coz dont think they aint watching their paypal console, i know i would be. That way you get a stellar reputation.
i've noticed this in the last years in Ebay....the choices of American silver coins, whether they be 90%'ers, 40%'ers or American Silver Eagles are dwindling.
90%'ers....i used to have my pick of 64 Kennedy's in GEM BU condition, i mean FLAWLESS coins in $10 FV rolls...tons....not so much now.
i used to have the pick of rolls of g4-vf Barber dimes and halves, rarely now seen. Washington Quarters? i was picking off solid date rolls of the 1932, first year of Washington's like crazy...i havent seen one roll in over a year, maybe more, One time, i saw a GEM BU, maybe really it was an AU-58 1936 solid date $10 roll, that was year my mother was born, but i thought i'd get cute and just bid $141.75, which was WAY over the prevailing instrinic value, and i got sniped, which made me crazy, because i USUALLY do the frigging sniping...i was prepared to bid $175-190, which at that time, was an INSANE bid...AT THAT TIME......
i also bought a goodly amount of Roosevelt dime rolls, they're not favorites, but i believe you gotta fractionalize, so i bought them, blah blah blah, and we did the run up to $50...'member?.....then the banksters stepped on the board, coz they didnt have the silver to deliver, but on the way down, every 90 roll was still trading high...well i found the "anti-dime", let me explain.
as you know the 90% dime is .07 toz a pice of silver, and they trade in $5 FV rolls, and i noticed at this time, while the markets going down, guys are dumping 40% Kennedy Halves (1965-1970) either AT or below melt. The 40 kennedy has .15 toz silver, almost like a "double dime", which means rolls of Roosie dimes trading at $140-160, lil over 3 toz of silver, i'm buying roll after roll of 40% Kennedy Halves, which contain 2.95 toz of silver between $90-120 a roll, i kid you not, and these rolls were clean, some circ's, some BU's and SOME gleaming Proofs...picked up a LOT of 1970 BU and Proof rolls. the 1970 Kennedy was the LAST year of common half dollar circ's, and IIRC, they minted maybe 4 to 5 million.
one more segment i really got into was the Silver Ike Roll, about six and half toz of Silver, each coin is .33 toz, a third of an oz...40%, low mint numbers, and completely neglected, therefore undervalued.....i think the reason guys neglect them, is coz they minted in COMMON circulation clad junk AND in a special 40% silver mintage, which was packaged by the mint, in a blue or brown hard envelope, Blue is uncirc, Brown is proof...so the danger is how do you 'tell' clad garbage from silver....the weight, clad is 22.6 gms, the silver is 24.6 gms...plus you can see the 'sandwiching' copper in the commons. Ike Proofs, 1971-1974 is really skeery, because in 73 and 74 they minted both clad and proof, so you HAVE to weigh every coin.
you rarely see rolls of silver Ikes now, and if you do?...the offer is UP there.
here's a great link to 'coin facts', mintage numbers, etc.
http://www.coincommunity.com/us_coin_facts/
and here's the url to a REALLY good forum, not only for discussion, but guys there trade in copper, nickel and silver, on the forum, its a really tight community, with some stellar folks, i never trade there, not because they're crook schweinhunds, but because they're friends, and i NEVER trade with friends, clouds your dealings. When i trade, my word is bond, my reputation is impecable, but i dont want to be your friend, i just want to do business and trade, or as "Gordon Gecko" said in relation to trade, "in this business, if you want a friend, get a dog".....anyway, the forum is "realcent dot org".....thats how i found this haunt of 'anti-liberals' (lol)...a brother there, told me about Dennis' infamous warning OP, said i'd like it there.
http://realcent.org/
as far as American Silver Eagle rolls, they have become RARE on Ebay, at least in the auctions, there's a number of them in the "buy it nows", if you want pay $1000 a roll...$50 an oz...not me.....you know what the really "hot" roll has become? the GEM/BU solid date, 1940's Walking Liberty Halves rolls....its a BEAUTIFUL coin, and when the offers were 'sane" i got some, but now they gotten IN---SANE...witness this auction, and compare it to, the following auction of AU's...its crazy.
insane bidding
http://www.ebay.com/itm/400319557502?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649
not so insane....but they are not all uncirc's, some ABOUT uncirc (AU's)
http://www.ebay.com/itm/200814283868?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649
now both these sellers are the two best silver roll sellers left on Ebay, "hsturn" and "carrieafl", and in way of transparency and disclaimer, i have no commercial ties or interest in either one, except that i've done extensive trading with them.
so i hope my long post is of benefit to you, its my way of being community here, coz frankly, i'm so tired and weary of reading how evil and wicked Obama and the hordes of predatory young negroes are, or how deep the doom is getting....i just want to stay focused on the stuff i have SOME control over.....so, be blessed. If you do Ampex, let us (me) know what they tossed in the bag...i'm curious.
Bud, silver's going to $250...yeh yeh, first we got to blow by 50...then i see 75-85, stop and fill there, another blast to $130...THEN we do a rocket ride to the 200's. Its real money, keep it secret, keep it safe, Shea
ohhhhh, okay Rave, so YOU'RE the one that was bidding against me all last frigging summer!!!....and quit doing that X, it'll rot your brain!!
i'm teasing you, i just wrote the same thing about the 40% Halves, given the time frame of mintage, even circs dont have THAT much wear, good trading to you, S.
fairbanksb
Freedom Isn't Free
When buying junk silver does it make a difference whether it is in BU condition. I don't see why it would.
We're in a deflationary depression, and have been for about 10 years. Things are getting more and more deflated and depressed.
Typically, PM's lose value in such times. I VERY much value PM's. I just think prices will resume lower soon, and therefore I'm waiting.
I don't buy high.
Typically, PM's lose value in such times. I VERY much value PM's. I just think prices will resume lower soon, and therefore I'm waiting.
I don't buy high.
Thats a misnomer....
We may be in a defaltionary period regarding SOME assets... like housing, non-necessity items, or cars, but when it comes to NEEDS, the fact is we are in the OPPOSITE.
Food, energy, commodities, healthcare, education... ALL are runnng at high inflationary modes.
Plus the fact that we are NO LONGER in an economy based on the 'Invisible Hand'. EVERYTHING in the economy is centrally controlled, and the basis of exchange (money), has been manipulated so badly it barely contains any value.
We are in a global economic paradigm, and every nation in the world EXCEPT THE WEST, is stockpiling gold because the current system is believed to be on its final legs.
Grammytomany
Inactive
It is a good idea to have it and HOLD it. but remember, only buy as much as you can afford to lose. It will always have value if you purchase good old U.S.A. junk value coins. Check around for prices. Remember what goes up, will come down. Remember the Hunt Brothers? I do.
Don't agree fully, but no matter. In your scenario, PM go up and up and up, all the time and there's no limit. Therefore the time to buy is always; yesterday, today, tomorrow, next week, next years - always. Prices always go up so you've got to buy now when there's still time and prices are low. Must be panic buying - prices are going to the moon, Alice.
Until that's not true.
I'll wait, thank you, but then, I'm a contrarion.
the only reason it does to me, on some rolls, is that i'm playing both sides of the fence, nusimatic and intrinsic, hence many rolls of 40's, dont have to BU's, as they would be for everyday trade, post dollar.
i also dont think of physical silver as "investment", but as like paying to insure an automobile, silver to me, is currency insurance.
Vicki
Girls With Guns Member
Now that Vicki asked my first question (thanks Vicki), may I now ask what a QE is??
Hey you're welcome IJM. QE is a term used for legalized stealing. They print more money to give it to the banks that don't lend it out and at the same time it lowers the value of the dollars you have in your hand. Pretty soon everyone will have dollars but they won't buy a thing. Remember when you could buy a candy bar for a nickle and now that same candy bar is a buck? Yeah, like that!
Arghhhh..
Everybody has to judge for themselves, the risk/reward ratio of
waiting for a drop to maybe buy cheaper later rather than now.
Personally, what little one might save, waiting for a drop before
buying, compared to how high it'll eventually go and possibly not
getting much of it if it takes off higher instead while waiting, is not
worth the risk, IMO.
I can also see where if we did have a substantial lower paper price
pullback, that does not guarantee at all that you will also be able to,
at that time, find any available then without a substantial premium
that could negate a lot of that savings you'd cleverly waited for. Also,
available selection then of what type & form of silver can narrow, too.
High premiums and crappy remaining available selection is what many,
that'll be late to the party, will have to contend with and settle for then.
I see a day coming where one guy bragging he'd bought his silver for
$5 less than another guy won't mean anything, all that'll count in that
day, and forever after, will only be how many total ounces do you now
physically have & hold.
- Shane
PS - As always, silver & gold are for people who already first have their
family preps and barterable goods largely squared away and find they still
have some dollars and paper investments remaining that they wish to then
explore diversifying some of that hard-earned wealth into some gold & silver.
waiting for a drop to maybe buy cheaper later rather than now.
Personally, what little one might save, waiting for a drop before
buying, compared to how high it'll eventually go and possibly not
getting much of it if it takes off higher instead while waiting, is not
worth the risk, IMO.
I can also see where if we did have a substantial lower paper price
pullback, that does not guarantee at all that you will also be able to,
at that time, find any available then without a substantial premium
that could negate a lot of that savings you'd cleverly waited for. Also,
available selection then of what type & form of silver can narrow, too.
High premiums and crappy remaining available selection is what many,
that'll be late to the party, will have to contend with and settle for then.
I see a day coming where one guy bragging he'd bought his silver for
$5 less than another guy won't mean anything, all that'll count in that
day, and forever after, will only be how many total ounces do you now
physically have & hold.
- Shane
PS - As always, silver & gold are for people who already first have their
family preps and barterable goods largely squared away and find they still
have some dollars and paper investments remaining that they wish to then
explore diversifying some of that hard-earned wealth into some gold & silver.
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I'll wait, thank you, but then, I'm a contrarion.
Let's see.
98% of Americans own no precious metals AT ALL for monetary insurance or investment purposes. A great many more Americans these days are SELLING what little PMs they have (old or broken gold jewelry, Aunt Mary's sterling silver flatware etc.), instead of buying PMs.
How do you extract a definition of being a contrarian out of going along with 98% of the population???
Or is going contrary to the 1.5% or 2% of the population that does own PMs enough to make a person a contra-contrarian?
Makes me dizzy to contemplate.
Let's see.
98% of Americans own no precious metals AT ALL for monetary insurance or investment purposes. A great many more Americans these days are SELLING what little PMs they have (old or broken gold jewelry, Aunt Mary's sterling silver flatware etc.), instead of buying PMs.
How do you extract a definition of being a contrarian out of going along with 98% of the population???
Or is going contrary to the 1.5% or 2% of the population that does own PMs enough to make a person a contra-contrarian?
Makes me dizzy to contemplate.
Should have been easy to figure out without a dizzy spell.
You're almost certainly right - 98% (probably higher) of the population neither have PM's, care about PM's, nor have any interest whatsoever about their pricing. So, NO, I'm not comparing myself with them.
I'm contrasting my view with the <2% who have some interest, some knowledge and some possession of PM's. They, almost to a person, believe PM prices have always gone up, are going up, will always go up and that it's the safest investment in the world. To these people there's no risk, it's all easy-street and one can transfer their hard-earned FRN's to PM's with absolutely no second thought required. Prices ALWAYS go up, so why wait? Why hesitate? Act now and buy now - tomorrow you'll regret it if you didn't.
After all - THEY'RE the contrarions in this, they believe. No one else is interested, so they MUST be correctly thinking by being interested. And the public gold bugs, to a man, are always bullish all the time, all day and all night.
I'm only saying that a true contrarion is one who analyses a market, looks for historical precedents, absorbs and mulls over a broad-base of expert opinion and then does what's probably in their best interest. What's probably in their best interest is to run against the current of this 2% crowd. This crowd absolutely believes PM's always go up. ALWAYS, without fail. Ever.
That's true until it isn't.
In a deflation, it isn't. Big time.
Moggy
Veteran Member
"I'm contrasting my view with the <2% who have some interest, some knowledge and some possession of PM's. They, almost to a person, believe PM prices have always gone up, are going up, will always go up and that it's the safest investment in the world. To these people there's no risk, it's all easy-street and one can transfer their hard-earned FRN's to PM's with absolutely no second thought required. Prices ALWAYS go up, so why wait? Why hesitate? Act now and buy now - tomorrow you'll regret it if you didn't."
It was Galileo Galilei who said: I do not feel obliged to believe that the same God who has endowed us with sense, reason, and intellect has intended us to forgo their use.
It was Galileo Galilei who said: I do not feel obliged to believe that the same God who has endowed us with sense, reason, and intellect has intended us to forgo their use.
Barry Natchitoches
Has No Life - Lives on TB
Yeah, I see deflation every time I walk into a grocery store..... NOT!
The things whose prices are being depressed are the things that are not essential for our well being and survival. The stuff we can live without.
The things that really matter: food, education, water, and health care (to name a few) keep escalating in price.
As for PMs, I'm not so sure.
I have a hard time seeing somebody trading food for a shiny metal disk in a SHTF situation.
On the other hand, right now the purchasing power of the dollar is sinking in quick sand, and PMs do seem (at least for the moment) to be a way to preserve the buying power of one's monetary wealth.
I don't care what anyone else does or doesn't do with their money. It's theirs, not mine. I don't want their money. Neither do I sell gold and silver or profit from any enterprise that does, save the mining and resource companies in which I own stocks.
I have no crystal ball. I don't know whether we will get inflation or deflation or stagflation (or something no one has ever seen before) in the future, or when that future will get here.
I don't know much about investing. But I do know that market timing is a good way to lose the lunch money.
And I also know that 'trees do not grow to the sky.' In other words, nothing goes up forever. Nothing.
I mostly stopped buying gold at $900, and silver at $28. It's been a while since I've bought anything PM wise worth mentioning. Meanwhile Bob Prechter's ancient (1998? 99?) call for gold at $200/ounce still stands untouched by the price line. And I bought gold at $260 anyway, despite Prechter's call.
So will gold ever see $200 again? NOPE - not 200 FRN$, anyway. Maybe 200 NewAmerikan Dollars or whatever, I don't know about that.
But play it however you see it - I did ... and I have a plan to sell too, when the time comes. Hell of a gold bug I am, with a plan to sell.
I have no crystal ball. I don't know whether we will get inflation or deflation or stagflation (or something no one has ever seen before) in the future, or when that future will get here.
I don't know much about investing. But I do know that market timing is a good way to lose the lunch money.
And I also know that 'trees do not grow to the sky.' In other words, nothing goes up forever. Nothing.
I mostly stopped buying gold at $900, and silver at $28. It's been a while since I've bought anything PM wise worth mentioning. Meanwhile Bob Prechter's ancient (1998? 99?) call for gold at $200/ounce still stands untouched by the price line. And I bought gold at $260 anyway, despite Prechter's call.
So will gold ever see $200 again? NOPE - not 200 FRN$, anyway. Maybe 200 NewAmerikan Dollars or whatever, I don't know about that.
But play it however you see it - I did ... and I have a plan to sell too, when the time comes. Hell of a gold bug I am, with a plan to sell.
Anti-Liberal
Veteran Member
What would be a better bet....junk or something like silver eagles. Take price per oz out of the equation, my main concern is someone doubting the validity of the metal. I already have several one oz bars from APMEX and Sunshine that i'm wondering if i'm screwed with since the chicoms have been producing fakes. I understand everything is faked but it seems the bars would be the easiest to fake and coins easier to prove legit.
Thank you to everyone who has posted.
Thank you to everyone who has posted.
Ravekid
Veteran Member
And this is why many folks would be better off just buying an additional used handgun, ammunition, camping supplies, food supplies, etc.. When folks talk about less than $10K in PMs, they likely need other things before PMs. PMs won't do much of anything in TSHTF. In centuries and decades past, when I believe people weren't as greedy and nacissistic, I think some gold or silver coins may have been able to bribe a border guard or two to let you pass. However, with the advent of the modern firearm, I believe a border guard could be just as likely to shoot you and your family dead and take all your stuff. It is much easier to attack a group of 5-10 when you have a rifle vs. a heavy sword or bow and arrow.
For example, I think the OP in this thread is looking to spend about $2,500 on PMs. Does the OP have water filtration covered? Small solar panels to recharge deep discharge batteries (for limited power options)? Some sort of heating device if they live in a cold climate? And related to that, tools to cut, split, and stack wood? Do they have a close by wooded lot with where they could obtain wood? How about a dutch over for cooking? Mylar bags and buckets for grain/rice storage?
For those who really have everything covered, and have "money" in the bank, then I would say dumping $10K-$50K in PMs is something to look into. However, those PMs are really only going to be worth something once the collapse is over. Does that mean during a collapse people won't want the stash, no, they will. Even if their isn't a market during a really bad depression era doesn't mean their never will be a market for PMs again. However, if it comes to carrying food or PMs, most people are going to go for food if it is hard to come by.
Ravekid
Veteran Member
My personal opinion would be to dump the bars and focus on what people know: US coins, maybe Canadian coins. As stated, your best hedge (in case there is no collapse, but a rally, of the FRN) is the 40% silver halves. The coin will always be worth at least .50. I would sell your bars, as you can't really trust them anymore without drilling them. I think my worry is even more so since the articles of fakes from China have been coming out. Some gun on Pawn Stars sold the shop $70K in silver. The owner of the shop made a comment he knew the mints from the smaller bars, so he trusted them. However, the guy had a huge brick of silver, and Rick drilled it three times and tested the flakes from the core sample to make sure it was silver all the way through. He made a comment about people making silver clad lead, etc..
I have a pretty well known PM/Coin shop in my state. It is somewhat of a drive, but I know they are trusted. They mint their own special silver bars and some more genaric (read: Ugly) looking bars. However, I wouldn't buy them just because anyone from China can get on-line and see the exact same front and back photos and start producing fakes. True they can do the same with US coins, which is why I would rather have the 40% halves more than anything.