GUNS/RLTD How Many Rounds Will A 400 Dollar AR-15 Last?

medic38572

medic38572

TB Fanatic
They put a PSA complete upper through the test, how long will it last? They run it fully auto, semi and single shot. Very interesting video you will be surprised by the results.

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cHGtjx_2qbQ

RT54:25

Join us as we put a $400 rifle to the ultimate test in this intense shooting video. We'll push this budget-friendly firearm to its limits until it begins to show signs of wear and tear. Can a cheap rifle stand up to the challenge, or will it fail to meet expectations? Tune in to find out!
 
M

Murt

Veteran Member
from what I got out of it at just over 6000 they declared the rifle "done"

I saw some tests years ago and with some of the cheap steel case rounds failures were starting at less than 2500 rounds

So IMO "how many rounds" depends on the quality of your rifle and the quality of your ammunition
 
mechanic 217

mechanic 217

I was told there would be cookies!
Good video, the barrel died, as Tristan said at 4500-5000 rounds, the bolt was worn etc, remember that the upper is 200-400 dollars, if you just need a backup or barn gun ok, for serious work you need to spend more, the build quality and components are just better ,pay your money make your choice.
 
T

thereisnofork

Veteran Member
It would be interesting if they have a test of say Daniel Defense or maybe Rock River Arms or something considered high end. I'm guessing we would not see much improvement. After all we are shooting 3200 FPS rounds. A high power/high velocity hunting rifle is estimated at what 3000 rounds?
The lesson here is have extra bolt rings, spare ejector/extractor and springs, extra detent pins/springs. And then a spare complete rifle.
Don't get stuck like we have in Washington state which bans assembly/manufacture by citizens. We can't even order a new/spare trigger assembly.
 
Blacula

Blacula

Dark Roasted
Considering the BCG and barrel are the wear items in any AR-15, this wouldn't put me off of a PSA. I have a couple of their Nitride barreled uppers as my "junk" guns, and have some CHF DD barreled uppers as my primaries. All of them run just fine and I doubt most people will ever shoot 5,000+ rounds through any gun that they own. I have, but that was shooting competitions every weekend for a decade.
 
medic38572

medic38572

TB Fanatic
Grumphau said:
I plan to watch this video later but 54 minutes is a long time! My guess would be that the rifle would last longer if it was given the chance to cool off. 6000 rounds in a day is good for any rifle, I would say.
Click to expand...
They said they fired 3 mags and then let it cool off to ambient temps which was chili. They suspect that maybe because it was silenced and autofire was the start of the breakdown more forces from the gas.
 
T

Thinwater

Firearms Manufacturer
K99 said:
could you just replace barrel and bcg and be good to go?
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Yes, they are the only thing that wears unless a pin starts wearing and wallers out the holes in the lower. A chrome lined barrel will extend full auto life. The gas tube will melt and fail first if kept in sustained full auto fire but you have to be wearing welding gloves to do this. I know, I did this test when I first began making AR15 s as a business.
 
Tristan

Tristan

Has No Life - Lives on TB
Grumphau said:
I plan to watch this video later but 54 minutes is a long time! My guess would be that the rifle would last longer if it was given the chance to cool off. 6000 rounds in a day is good for any rifle, I would say.
Click to expand...

Addressed in the video. They let it return to ambient temp. (pretty cold) every 90 rounds.

Lone_Hawk said:
The parts that started to fail are exactly the ones that I would expect from an AR platform at that round count no matter if you spent $400 or $4,000
Click to expand...

He did state very clearly that if you are depending on it, get a better rifle, but at the same time, the increase in prices nets smaller and smaller gains in performance.
 
T

Thinwater

Firearms Manufacturer
An all 3d printed AR that I am building. I am sanding it now for painting then will drop in the lower parts kits, bolt group, buffer, spring, and barrel with the gas block and tube. I am just building it for fun since I have a couple dozen good ones. IMG_20240303_173820815~2.jpg
 
Lone_Hawk

Lone_Hawk

Resident Spook
For those that have, or will be, getting extra parts for the EBRs. You need to test your new BCGs in all of your rifles. Depending on barrel length, and gas block locations, you may have short stroking issues. For example, going from a MIL-SPEC BCG to one with a coating such as nickle boron, not all BCGs are the same. Some you might have to break them in a bit for them to function properly across your entire stable.
 
M

Matt

Veteran Member
Kyle Rittenhouse.... I would bet shot less than 2000 rounds in training and less than 10 in "combat".... PSA is a great deal. All 4 of my sons have a PSA rifle with red dot sights.... money well spent.

As much as I hate what has become of the USMC.... im glad i did it and the the train the trainer weapons and tactics aspect will always be admired by me and mine.

The skill set I have given them on those PSA rifles carries over too. My 15, 13 and 12 year old sons can all get behind my Daniel Defense with an ACOG and get >80% hits on a LEO pistol target at 500 meters with bulk green tip from the prone. My 8 year old is just too little... he will be proficient in a year or two! I have him making head shots at 15 meters with a 9mm hand gun though!
 
Groucho

Groucho

Has No Life - Lives on TB
Firing like that will tend to cause accelerated throat erosion. I didn't see where they ran a TE gauge down to get a reading. That will screw up accuracy fast. Others have said the chamber and barrel should be chromed. I don't know if PSA offers a chromed bbl.
Extractors, ejectors and springs should be part of your kit.
A quick check of prices for Daniels and LMT 16"bbl chrome lined are 2400.00 and ~2000+ respectively. The PSA complete is about 400 for the upper and 140 for a lower.
Seriously, if I were worried about the gun crapping out at 5000 rounds, I'd go slower on the trigger and have an extra upper or two plus spare parts/springs.

Different platform, but when I had my M1A, it displayed accuracy problems at around 8000 rounds. I took it to a gunsmith I knew and he ran the TE gauge down it. The throat was totally out of spec. I think it was an 8 which is no go. When I told him the round count, he said I was a little "horsey" on the trigger and that I should slow down. He gladly re-barreled the rifle. That was back when mil-surp was flooding the market and cases could be had for around 150-200 bucks. It was good stuff, too. Turns out mad minutes all the time were not a good idea. When I was firing like an adult, the rifle was 1-1/2 moa with good ammo.

All of it is gone now. Between the boat accident and the package of spare parts falling off the truck and into the river, all I have left are memories.
 
Mark D

Mark D

Now running for Emperor.
The vast majority of gun owners will never shoot a combined 4000 rounds of anything, over the duration of their life, let alone 4000+ rounds out of a single rifle.

Also... The vast majority of gun owners won't get through their first magazine if the "S" actually ends up hitting the "F." They will die from the Crisco in their veins, or from genuine Human Predators, while they are still wearing their Cheeto-stained pajamas.

Notice the specific use of the term "gun owner" rather than "Shooter," or "Gunfighter."

Those who manage to survive the first days and weeks of a genuine SHTF event, will have their pick of high-end weapons and gear.
 
Wildweasel

Wildweasel

F-4 Phantoms Phorever
K99 said:
could you just replace barrel and bcg and be good to go?
Click to expand...
I'd replace the bolt rather than the whole BCG and have parts (springs, gas rings) ready to rebuild the bolt. Having several spare bolts and swapping them out as needed is much cheaper than swapping BCGs, if you have a quality BCG to start with.

Replacing a barrel is a gunsmith job, so if your barrel goes out swapping the entire upper for one with a fresh barrel is the easiest method of keeping your gun running. Again, a ready to go spare upper is easy and comparatively cheap.
 
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subnet

subnet

Boot
Wildweasel said:
I'd replace the bolt rather than the whole BCG and have parts (springs, gas rings) ready to rebuild the bolt. Having several spare bolts and swapping them out as needed is much cheaper than swapping BCGs, if you have a quality BCG to start with.

Replacing a barrel is a gunsmith job, so if your barrel goes out swapping the entire upper for one with a fresh barrel is the easiest method of keeping your gun running. Again, a ready to go spare upper is easy and comparatively cheap.
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Not so much on ar platforms, i build my uppers being its cheaper "usually" and i can spec them how i like with what i can afford.
Spare uppers are a good thing

Watched a vid where they take a 500 dollar anderson complete weapon and run 1000 rounds full auto, no breaks, straight through it and had only one misfire, dude thought the gas tube would fail but nope, he now carries them at his shop
 
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medic38572

medic38572

TB Fanatic
Tristan said:
The answer, depending on how you look at it, was around 4500-5000 rounds.

But they did note that for PSA particularly, you could send the upper in for a free complete refurb.
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It was 6020 rounds before the bullets wandered off MOA by several inches and they stopped, but they did stop somewhere in the 4000+ range after the extractor spring started acting up and weakened to the point that they had ejection problems. They had a fella from Dexar firearms who pulled Bolt and everything and checked it. The bolt was starting to wear as well compared to high-dollar bolts.
 
ArisenCarcass

ArisenCarcass

Veteran Member
Wildweasel said:
Replacing a barrel is a gunsmith job, so if your barrel goes out swapping the entire upper for one with a fresh barrel is the easiest method of keeping your gun running. Again, a ready to go spare upper is easy and comparatively cheap.
Click to expand...
NOPE.
An AR barrel change takes one $12 tool for the old school delta ring.
For newer free-floated handguards, most people could get by with a pair of channel locks (in a pinch, if they don't have a spanner).
Either way, it takes about 10 minutes, and is hardly a "gunsmith job."
Is it as quick as changing the upper (2 pins)? No..........but it saves hundreds $$$.

The AR is a lego set for men....easy to build and customize.
I'd advise everyone to learn the rifle.
They do have a habit of multiplying once you figure out how to build one, though (wow here's a detent........guess I need to build another rifle for it. :D )
 
Lone_Hawk

Lone_Hawk

Resident Spook
ArisenCarcass said:
NOPE.
An AR barrel change takes one $12 tool for the old school delta ring.
For newer free-floated handguards, most people could get by with a pair of channel locks (in a pinch, if they don't have a spanner).
Either way, it takes about 10 minutes, and is hardly a "gunsmith job."
Is it as quick as changing the upper (2 pins)? No..........but it saves hundreds $$$.

The AR is a lego set for men....easy to build and customize.
I'd advise everyone to learn the rifle.
They do have a habit of multiplying once you figure out how to build one, though (wow here's a detent........guess I need to build another rifle for it. :D )
Click to expand...
True.... Kinda..... The #1 problem with home/buddy built ARs that come into the gunsmith shop have barrels that the barrel nut was not properly torqued and it came loose. So..... maybe not....
 
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