CORONA Main Coronavirus thread
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Binkerthebear
Veteran Member
Tristan
Has No Life - Lives on TB
My digging has led me to this. The first link has good links including the ones below. The last one get pretty technical.
View: https://twitter.com/GuoLibrary/status/1221580367062237185
The Farm: “P4” Biological Superweapons Development - GNEWS
Only nation states possess the resources to isolate such a disease from, say, a Zhoushon bat and imbue it with the capacity for human-to-human transfergnews.org
If true, that's a big ol' can of worms that has just been opened.
Heliobas Disciple
TB Fanatic
The coronavirus questions that scientists are racing to answer
Here are some of the outstanding questions that doctors, scientists, and health agencies are rushing to answer about the #coronavirus.
www.statnews.com
The coronavirus questions that scientists are racing to answer
By Helen Branswell and Andrew Joseph
January 28, 2020
The outbreak of a novel coronavirus in China and its spread to more than a dozen countries has presented health experts with a rapidly evolving and complex challenge.
That means there are a lot of unknowns.
Here are some of the outstanding questions that doctors, scientists, and health agencies are rushing to answer. (And a reminder that, already, they’ve learned quite a lot.)
When are people contagious?
One of the luckiest breaks the world got with the SARS outbreak of 2002-2003 was that people weren’t contagious until they developed symptoms. The same is true of MERS. As a result, it became easier for health officials to try to limit spread once they identified a new case.
Public health experts watching this outbreak unfold have been hoping 2019-nCoV, which is a member of the same virus family, would follow that pattern. Now they’re not so sure.
Chinese health authorities said over the weekend they’ve recorded cases where transmission occurred before the transmitting person showed symptoms. And German authorities reported a case Tuesday in which a man was infected by a colleague visiting from China. The colleague only began to feel sick on her flight back home.
If that’s a common feature of this infection, it’s going to cause serious problems.
With some viral illnesses — like influenza for example — people can actually start infecting the people around them a day or two before they start to feel sick. That’s insidious, because it means infected people can go to work, take the subway, go to church or to the movies — unaware that they are emitting viruses that can infect others.
How long is the period between when a person gets infected and when they develop symptoms?
In the past few days several papers from China describing the illness have been published or posted on preprint websites (sites that share papers before they have been peer-reviewed or published in journals). In a paper posted to bioRxiv, scientists from Guangdong province estimated the incubation period — the time from infection to symptoms — to average between four and five days, which was also the case with SARS. There is clearly a range, though; on Monday, the WHO said the information to date suggests two to 10 days.
Another paper, published last Friday in The Lancet, estimated the incubation period in a cluster of six family members to be three to six days. These estimates are compatible and suggest it takes a few days for people to start feeling ill — which explains how a number of travelers who have brought the virus to other countries only realized they were sick a day or two after getting home.
Are there mild cases that aren’t being detected? How big a proportion of the overall cases are they?
Most diseases have a spectrum of illness, ranging sometimes from asymptomatic infection — symptom free — to very severe disease and death. But some diseases tend to tilt toward one end of the spectrum.
With SARS, most of the cases were seriously ill. While that was bad for anyone infected, it made detecting where the virus was spreading easier. In this outbreak, it’s starting to look like there are mild and even asymptomatic cases.
How often they occur still isn’t clear. Nor is it known yet if they are able to transmit the virus, or how often they do. With some illnesses, mild and asymptomatic cases don’t contribute much to spread.
How dangerous is this infection?
The reports emerging suggest a pretty significant portion of cases are seriously ill. For instance, in a report China’s national health authorities posted Monday, about 17% of total cases were severely ill. And about 3% of confirmed cases had died.
Those are frightening numbers. But if the confirmed cases represent only a fraction of the total cases — and they likely do — that could really change the math. Until we have a better handle on the total number of cases it’s premature to draw conclusions.
How far has the virus spread already?
It’s hard to get a clear picture.
On Monday, infectious diseases experts from Hong Kong University said they believe the virus is now transmitting person-to-person, in a sustained way, in all major cities in mainland China.
Epidemiologists who use mathematical modeling to calculate disease spread have been looking at how many cases have been found in other countries. There are formulas that give you an idea of how many infections probably occurred in China before a case was exported.
As of Sunday, when the number of exported cases was approaching 60, Neil Ferguson of Imperial College London estimated there were likely already 100,000 cases in China. But that was two days ago.
Ferguson told STAT it’s getting hard to run that calculation, “given the exit screening and then quarantine of Wuhan,” the central Chinese city where the outbreak is believed to have started.
To date, about 14 countries and territories outside of mainland China have detected cases, but none has yet reported seeing sustained human-to-human transmission of the virus.
China is taking unprecedented and draconian measures to stop the virus from spreading, cutting off transit to cities with millions of people. Can these measures work?
Nothing like this has ever been tried before.
During the 2003 SARS outbreak, the World Health Organization issued what were called “travel advisories” — telling people around the world not to go to affected cities. The travel advisories, which the WHO has never used since, were loathed by the locations battling SARS, which saw tourism dry up and hotel vacancies soar. Though they certainly had the desired effect of driving away tourists, the travel advisories were advice only.
In China, this isn’t advice. The country is cutting off travel between cities. Is it possible to enforce? Can the Chinese economy sustain this? Big, big unknowns right now.
And will these measures stop the spread of the disease? When draconian restrictions are imposed, desperate people tend to use underground efforts to get around them. Still, spread of the virus may happen at a lower or slower rate than if the measures weren’t put into place.
In the end, it may turn out these measures were imposed too late. Analysis of the genetic sequences of viruses from more than two dozen cases suggest the virus had been transmitting person-to-person for a couple of months now — maybe starting in November or early December.
Was there initial transmission outside of the seafood market that authorities tied many of the first cases to?
Now that the virus appears to be spreading effectively among people, tracking down the initial source has become secondary to trying to contain the outbreak. But both as a scientific curiosity and for possible insights about how to prevent the next outbreak, it’s useful to know when and how the virus started infecting people.
Early in the outbreak, local authorities in Wuhan said that most of the early cases were linked in some way to a large seafood market that also had live animals for meat. This seemed like a logical source for the outbreak; coronaviruses can jump from animals to infect people. These viruses are thought to originate in bats, but can use a middleman as they hopscotch to humans. The 2002-2003 SARS outbreak, for example, was traced to palm civets, while MERS infections come from camels.
But then last week, in some of the first analyses of the initial cases, a team of researchers reported that the first patient in Wuhan hospitalized with pneumonia caused by the virus had no tie to the market. The patient’s symptoms also started a week earlier than later cases who were tied to the market.
That raises several possibilities: Perhaps the virus was spreading among people earlier than first noticed or reported by Wuhan health officials, and that one of these patients brought the virus to the market. Or, perhaps there was a group of infected animals that could have seeded the outbreak at different locations.
Blizzard
Senior Member
Let me be really blunt here. PAY ATTENTION!
I'll put this in terms of Trump's earlier tweet.
"We are in very close communication with China concerning the virus." YES WE ARE - both officially (full of PC lies) and unofficially (in direct contact with researchers and family members of researcher that are in this country.)
"Very few cases REPORTED in the USA, but strongly on watch." Reported by the political CDC. They are SCUM - they will do anything not to create a panic. I know they lie specifically due to the "boots on ground" work my boss has done on ebola and SARS. "Officially" there are few confirmed nCoV cases publicized in the US. There are a whole bunch of people being investigated. There are even MORE secondary contacts. Case in point, in my own town we have an individual who came in on the same flight as the first positive in Washington state. NO ONE has officially contacted him or his family. (We are feeding him facts and recommendations at a distance.)
"We have offered China and President Xi any help that is necessary." We have University links to several research facilities in China and directly with personnel there. The Fake News reports and the clinical reports we've received so far are dramatically different. There is a lot of high-quality information coming in directly to and from researchers. Chinese politics will "save face". Researchers are saving lives and getting the technical information out.
"Our experts are extraordinary!" Absolutely! My boss has a 200+ IQ (tested). He has US patents out the ying-yang. He has spoken directly with the President in the past. His team is just as extraordinary. I am responsible for the medical health of that team (Don't ask how this dumbass Emergency Physician got linked into this group - I just consider it a privilege to know these people that make a profound difference in the world EVERY DAY.)
HERE ARE THE FACTS AS I KNOW THEM:
1. They have traced the virus back to "Patient 0" (I can't find anymore unclassified information about him.) .
2. The original virus contains gene sequences from a "Civit" (cat like), "Krate Snake" and "Horseshoe Bat". There is a great argument about who ate/got infected by whom first. The exotic meat of all three were sold at the Meat Market at WuHan. The possibility of a weaponized/engineered virus has NOT been ruled out.
3. There is a HIGH suspicion this can be transmitted to/from snakes, domestic cats and bats though that is unproven at this time.
4. The virus has evolved TOWARD better human to human transmission and IS continuing to do so.
5. The PUBLIC numbers from China are EXTREMELY LOW. (Direct information to researchers in the US from family of researchers that are in the field themselves. You can dispute all the videos and statements coming out of China, but that fact remains they are reacting much more aggressively in response to this than the seasonal flu that kills thousands times the current "official" nC0V numbers.)
6. The current OFFICIAL rate of sustained infection (R0) is 1.4 to 2.6. Anything over 1 is considered to be self-sustaining. (I suspect that number is much higher due to undocumented infections, whether hidden, self-quarantined, mis-diagnosed or unable to see a documenting health professional. )
7. Current (well documented) incubation is 1-14 days.
8. Infected can shed virus 2-5 days BEFORE showing symptoms of their infection.
9. Surface survival of the virus is approximately 15 minutes (Exposed to sun and chemicals) and up to 7+ days when not exposed to high moisture and UV radiation. (WuHan is a big manufacturing area for the world - Budweiser Beer has been produced there since the mid-90's. Think of all the exports. Think of the contact spread of the virus.)
10. You have to get a certain number of viri to produce an infection. That number is unknown. Avoid areas where people/germs can concentrate (planes, trains, autos, meeting rooms, etc.)
THINGS TO DO:
- Stay home.
- Don't allow visitors.
- Wash your hands, wash your hands, wash your hands - for 20 seconds at least, and with soap (Don't depend on hand sanitizers - some are not effective and people don't always use them properly).
- Wash your hands before putting anything in your mouth.
- Nothing in mucus membranes (Eyes, ears, nose, mouth, vagina, anus). Sorry Ladies and Gentleman, you are going to have to put away your toys for the duration.
- Don't touch your face.
- Avoid crowds, gatherings, clinics and ESPECIALLY hospitals.
- If you have to go out as this develops, mask, gloves, whole body clothing - then launder/shower when home.
- Prep for sheltering-in-place for a minimum of 2 weeks.
- Get it done!
HERE IS WHAT I AM DOING:
Yes, I have to work.
For simple masks we only use N-100s. Anything less is insufficient (will leak during normal activities and are uncomfortable to wear for an extended period of time - read you will touch the outer surface repeatedly to adjust it - BAD) and in the case of surgical masks - those ear loop pieces of cloth/paper, can enhance the spread of the infection when they get wet from regular respirations (20 minutes). BTDT
We use clear wrap around protective lenses generally and goggles for bad stuff. The goggles work well as I can keep my glasses on.
The house has several HEPA air filters, both floor units and high-grade AC filters in the forced air unit (pain in the butt to replace every 3 months).
We wipe everything with Clorox Clean-ups (switches, door handles, railings, anything your hand touches). We wash is as high as temperature as permissible - bodies, clothing, dishes, etc.
We are now experimenting with UV-C hand wands for non-wipe-able items.
RETURNING FROM A DAY AT THE CLINIC:
I come in the basement door and drop my clothing in the laundry or directly into the washer. Doctor bag stays in the basement. (We are experimenting with UV-C lighting for the laundry when we are not there). Shoes/Doctor bag get sprayed with Lysol or UV wanded. From there, I head directly to the shower and redress in clean clothing. The wife wipes everything I've touched down with Clorox Cleanups. Only then do I kiss the wife, play with the dogs, get something to eat, and check my e-mails. After that, its time to drag the wife off to bed for some fun. Since the AIDS epidemic way back when, we agreed to share any lethal bug I might contract in my job - personal choice.
This procedure of stripping and showering got my physician Grandfather through the Spanish Flu without infection as he saw patients in their homes daily. We actually read it in my Grandmother's diary and adopted the practice here.
I will provide more information as it becomes available. Please don't hit me with PMs or open questions. I don't have the time and get really snarky when I get exhausted.
Good luck and Godspeed.
Blizzard, MD, FACEP
I'll put this in terms of Trump's earlier tweet.
"We are in very close communication with China concerning the virus." YES WE ARE - both officially (full of PC lies) and unofficially (in direct contact with researchers and family members of researcher that are in this country.)
"Very few cases REPORTED in the USA, but strongly on watch." Reported by the political CDC. They are SCUM - they will do anything not to create a panic. I know they lie specifically due to the "boots on ground" work my boss has done on ebola and SARS. "Officially" there are few confirmed nCoV cases publicized in the US. There are a whole bunch of people being investigated. There are even MORE secondary contacts. Case in point, in my own town we have an individual who came in on the same flight as the first positive in Washington state. NO ONE has officially contacted him or his family. (We are feeding him facts and recommendations at a distance.)
"We have offered China and President Xi any help that is necessary." We have University links to several research facilities in China and directly with personnel there. The Fake News reports and the clinical reports we've received so far are dramatically different. There is a lot of high-quality information coming in directly to and from researchers. Chinese politics will "save face". Researchers are saving lives and getting the technical information out.
"Our experts are extraordinary!" Absolutely! My boss has a 200+ IQ (tested). He has US patents out the ying-yang. He has spoken directly with the President in the past. His team is just as extraordinary. I am responsible for the medical health of that team (Don't ask how this dumbass Emergency Physician got linked into this group - I just consider it a privilege to know these people that make a profound difference in the world EVERY DAY.)
HERE ARE THE FACTS AS I KNOW THEM:
1. They have traced the virus back to "Patient 0" (I can't find anymore unclassified information about him.) .
2. The original virus contains gene sequences from a "Civit" (cat like), "Krate Snake" and "Horseshoe Bat". There is a great argument about who ate/got infected by whom first. The exotic meat of all three were sold at the Meat Market at WuHan. The possibility of a weaponized/engineered virus has NOT been ruled out.
3. There is a HIGH suspicion this can be transmitted to/from snakes, domestic cats and bats though that is unproven at this time.
4. The virus has evolved TOWARD better human to human transmission and IS continuing to do so.
5. The PUBLIC numbers from China are EXTREMELY LOW. (Direct information to researchers in the US from family of researchers that are in the field themselves. You can dispute all the videos and statements coming out of China, but that fact remains they are reacting much more aggressively in response to this than the seasonal flu that kills thousands times the current "official" nC0V numbers.)
6. The current OFFICIAL rate of sustained infection (R0) is 1.4 to 2.6. Anything over 1 is considered to be self-sustaining. (I suspect that number is much higher due to undocumented infections, whether hidden, self-quarantined, mis-diagnosed or unable to see a documenting health professional. )
7. Current (well documented) incubation is 1-14 days.
8. Infected can shed virus 2-5 days BEFORE showing symptoms of their infection.
9. Surface survival of the virus is approximately 15 minutes (Exposed to sun and chemicals) and up to 7+ days when not exposed to high moisture and UV radiation. (WuHan is a big manufacturing area for the world - Budweiser Beer has been produced there since the mid-90's. Think of all the exports. Think of the contact spread of the virus.)
10. You have to get a certain number of viri to produce an infection. That number is unknown. Avoid areas where people/germs can concentrate (planes, trains, autos, meeting rooms, etc.)
THINGS TO DO:
- Stay home.
- Don't allow visitors.
- Wash your hands, wash your hands, wash your hands - for 20 seconds at least, and with soap (Don't depend on hand sanitizers - some are not effective and people don't always use them properly).
- Wash your hands before putting anything in your mouth.
- Nothing in mucus membranes (Eyes, ears, nose, mouth, vagina, anus). Sorry Ladies and Gentleman, you are going to have to put away your toys for the duration.
- Don't touch your face.
- Avoid crowds, gatherings, clinics and ESPECIALLY hospitals.
- If you have to go out as this develops, mask, gloves, whole body clothing - then launder/shower when home.
- Prep for sheltering-in-place for a minimum of 2 weeks.
- Get it done!
HERE IS WHAT I AM DOING:
Yes, I have to work.
For simple masks we only use N-100s. Anything less is insufficient (will leak during normal activities and are uncomfortable to wear for an extended period of time - read you will touch the outer surface repeatedly to adjust it - BAD) and in the case of surgical masks - those ear loop pieces of cloth/paper, can enhance the spread of the infection when they get wet from regular respirations (20 minutes). BTDT
We use clear wrap around protective lenses generally and goggles for bad stuff. The goggles work well as I can keep my glasses on.
The house has several HEPA air filters, both floor units and high-grade AC filters in the forced air unit (pain in the butt to replace every 3 months).
We wipe everything with Clorox Clean-ups (switches, door handles, railings, anything your hand touches). We wash is as high as temperature as permissible - bodies, clothing, dishes, etc.
We are now experimenting with UV-C hand wands for non-wipe-able items.
RETURNING FROM A DAY AT THE CLINIC:
I come in the basement door and drop my clothing in the laundry or directly into the washer. Doctor bag stays in the basement. (We are experimenting with UV-C lighting for the laundry when we are not there). Shoes/Doctor bag get sprayed with Lysol or UV wanded. From there, I head directly to the shower and redress in clean clothing. The wife wipes everything I've touched down with Clorox Cleanups. Only then do I kiss the wife, play with the dogs, get something to eat, and check my e-mails. After that, its time to drag the wife off to bed for some fun. Since the AIDS epidemic way back when, we agreed to share any lethal bug I might contract in my job - personal choice.
This procedure of stripping and showering got my physician Grandfather through the Spanish Flu without infection as he saw patients in their homes daily. We actually read it in my Grandmother's diary and adopted the practice here.
I will provide more information as it becomes available. Please don't hit me with PMs or open questions. I don't have the time and get really snarky when I get exhausted.
Good luck and Godspeed.
Blizzard, MD, FACEP
Last edited:
MinnesotaSmith
Membership Revoked
"Holy S**t!" if accurate?
View: https://twitter.com/DrEricDing/status/1220919589623803905?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1220919589623803905&ref_url=https://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2020/01/links-1-25-2020.html
JonRead
@JonRead15
· Jan 24
With lots of uncertainty in both case data and model uncertainty, R0 estimates will be changing rapidly. Important to update and monitor. We've updated our estimates with case data through 22 Jan. New estimated R0 of 2.5 95% CI 2.4, 2.6. Paper to be updated asap.
Show this thread
Dan Nguyen
@dancow
·
Jan 25
Replying to
@DrEricDing
Are these R0 values on Wikipedia incorrect? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Basic_reproduction_number…
View: https://twitter.com/DrEricDing/status/1220919589623803905?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1220919589623803905&ref_url=https://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2020/01/links-1-25-2020.html
JonRead
@JonRead15
· Jan 24
With lots of uncertainty in both case data and model uncertainty, R0 estimates will be changing rapidly. Important to update and monitor. We've updated our estimates with case data through 22 Jan. New estimated R0 of 2.5 95% CI 2.4, 2.6. Paper to be updated asap.
Show this thread
Dan Nguyen
@dancow
·
Jan 25
Replying to
@DrEricDing
Are these R0 values on Wikipedia incorrect? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Basic_reproduction_number…
Melodi
Disaster Cat
Some things are being learned (outside of China) Nightwolf was able to get information (for example) that this seems to affect the lower lungs right from the start, which is highly unusual for this type of virus.
He also said it means that people are not always getting that warning scratchy throat or nasal congestion, which I suspect is one reason a lot of people in China have kept going until they fell down.
I've had serious and sudden on-set lung things like that, the one I wrote about a few years ago in the UK only took about five hours from feeling a bit off to having trouble breathing.
Thank goodness that one was bacterial and I got great care from the NHS (and their ambulance drivers) but I can see how easy it would be for focused people at work or whatever to ignore this until suddenly, you can't breathe and you fall down.
He also said it means that people are not always getting that warning scratchy throat or nasal congestion, which I suspect is one reason a lot of people in China have kept going until they fell down.
I've had serious and sudden on-set lung things like that, the one I wrote about a few years ago in the UK only took about five hours from feeling a bit off to having trouble breathing.
Thank goodness that one was bacterial and I got great care from the NHS (and their ambulance drivers) but I can see how easy it would be for focused people at work or whatever to ignore this until suddenly, you can't breathe and you fall down.
Heliobas Disciple
TB Fanatic
MinnesotaSmith
Membership Revoked
"Holy S**t!" if accurate?
View: https://twitter.com/DrEricDing/status/1220919589623803905?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1220919589623803905&ref_url=https://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2020/01/links-1-25-2020.html
View attachment 180754
JonRead
@JonRead15
· Jan 24
With lots of uncertainty in both case data and model uncertainty, R0 estimates will be changing rapidly. Important to update and monitor. We've updated our estimates with case data through 22 Jan. New estimated R0 of 2.5 95% CI 2.4, 2.6. Paper to be updated asap.
Show this thread
Dan Nguyen
@dancow
·
Jan 25
Replying to
@DrEricDing
Are these R0 values on Wikipedia incorrect? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Basic_reproduction_number…
View attachment 180754
View: https://twitter.com/DrEricDing/status/1220919589623803905?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1220919589623803905&ref_url=https://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2020/01/links-1-25-2020.html
View attachment 180754
JonRead
@JonRead15
· Jan 24
With lots of uncertainty in both case data and model uncertainty, R0 estimates will be changing rapidly. Important to update and monitor. We've updated our estimates with case data through 22 Jan. New estimated R0 of 2.5 95% CI 2.4, 2.6. Paper to be updated asap.
Show this thread
Dan Nguyen
@dancow
·
Jan 25
Replying to
@DrEricDing
Are these R0 values on Wikipedia incorrect? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Basic_reproduction_number…
View attachment 180754
Heliobas Disciple
TB Fanatic
Definitely. I was worrying about this when the NIH doctor said they were working on a vaccine based on the data the Chinese gave them, that they didn't need to test it themselves because it is so wonderful how now everyone shares everything so openly, fully trusting that it was accurate. Famous last words (?).
HD
Tristan
Has No Life - Lives on TB
Don't take it as personal. Kris was pointing out that the size of the planes are not to scale with the map in the background, which leads one to believe that the sun is blotted out by the number of planes. Same as the dots identifying the wuhan-virus hit localities on this site:
If you zoom in and out on the map you can see that the markers don't change size, and if you zoom out far enough it appears that the virus covers the entire country...
Visualizations are a whole other area where there is plenty of opportunity for misunderstanding.
Peace.
bw
Fringe Ranger
There is no such number. You need only one, if it gets lucky. What they're saying is like it's a shotgun, and it takes so many pellets to hit a dime at fifty feet. It takes only one pellet to hit a dime at fifty feet, and the more pellets the higher your confidence is.
EVERY virus ALWAYS is selected for better transmission. Evolution is the passive and undirected result of whatever works. The virus does not evolve toward something; natural selection PUSHES it toward something.
marsh
On TB every waking moment
This time it was transmitted by a male carrier, not the same female carrier. It was apparently a meeting where at least two employees with Chinese ties infected two German employees. Seems to be pretty virulent.
Heliobas Disciple
TB Fanatic
Thank you for your post. We are lucky to have you contributing to this thread. Any updates you can share are much appreciated.
HD
psychgirl
Has No Life - Lives on TB
Ran over to Kroger a bit ago. Saw one wonan wearing a mask.
I also had to drop off my insurance card at Dr office which is in a St Vincent hospital here. I asked, she said no directives or announcements had been given there, yet. She shrugged, then just said she hoped not, but it’s only a matter of time before someone here came down with the virus.
I also had to drop off my insurance card at Dr office which is in a St Vincent hospital here. I asked, she said no directives or announcements had been given there, yet. She shrugged, then just said she hoped not, but it’s only a matter of time before someone here came down with the virus.
Melodi
Disaster Cat
ELINT News Retweeted
BNO Newsroom
@BNODesk
·
50s
Bavarian Health Ministry says the 3 new patients are colleagues of the 1st case. It was previously reported that the 1st patient had been working just hours before being diagnosed with coronavirus.
Quote Tweet
BNO Newsroom
@BNODesk
· 2m
BREAKING: Germany reports 3 new cases of coronavirus
BNO Newsroom
@BNODesk
·
50s
Bavarian Health Ministry says the 3 new patients are colleagues of the 1st case. It was previously reported that the 1st patient had been working just hours before being diagnosed with coronavirus.
Quote Tweet
BNO Newsroom
@BNODesk
· 2m
BREAKING: Germany reports 3 new cases of coronavirus
Doc1
Has No Life - Lives on TB
Just a quick note: I usually follow MSM and alternatives throughout the day as I work in my shop and do the usual homestead chores. It strikes me that there has seemingly been a falloff on Coronavirus reporting today. I can't help but wonder if China is increasingly cracking down on news and if our own .gov/media isn't doing the same thing to mitigate panic and reduce the horrible impact the virus had on our markets yesterday. Hey, I could be dead wrong and I've hardly conducted a scientific survey, but this is just my impression today. Anyone else have a similar - or entirely different - perspective?
Best
Doc
Best
Doc
Heliobas Disciple
TB Fanatic
Hard to to say for certain. One of them could've given it to the other and to the two Germans. Both Germans could have gotten it from one or them, or from each of them, or each from a different one. Unless they were in separate parts of the building and didn't interact with each other or the other Chinese person, we can't say for certain.
But agree, this is very virulent. I wonder if they are putting the whole company in quarantine. They are all exposed to each other every day. And then they go home to their families, who go out in public, and so on and so on and so on.
HD
bbbuddy
DEPLORABLE ME
My Alma Mater. Gorgeous campus. I probably wouldn't recognize it now after 51 years...
Heliobas Disciple
TB Fanatic
Melodi
Disaster Cat
To be clear, the news out of Germany is there are now three GERMAN/Barvarian patients, who are believed to have been infected at the same meeting or at least workplace.
While EU laws prevent the names of people being published unless they give permission (or under some circumstances) I would be shocked if they were all "Asian" rather than just the usual run of Bavarian Germans.
While EU laws prevent the names of people being published unless they give permission (or under some circumstances) I would be shocked if they were all "Asian" rather than just the usual run of Bavarian Germans.
As am I. My friend was at hospital with her daughter (who's in chemo by the way) in emergency for five hours while she puked in a bag till they finally got her a room. He was on another floor in isolation, but talk about close...my daughter is a nurse at another hospital in a nearby city- she's very defensive about my concerns about the virus. What God has planned will be whether we like it or not....
Doomer Doug
TB Fanatic
Well, keeping up with this thread has been a real interesting process. Here are a few thoughts: Oregon also has a "city"named Ontario in the far Eastern part of the state on the Snake, yep Snake River border with Idaho!! Next, it is clear Emperor Li got blindsided by what I conclude was either an accidental virus release and/or the pork on the side deal. His rapid and Decisive actions show the situation is much worse than the 106 dead and 4,000 infected would justify. I THINK 1000 DEAD AND 100,000 INFECTED IS A BARE MINIMUM. I have been prepping like crazy the last few days. The sheeple are focusing on Kobe Bryant's helicopter death and the impeachment farce. I have no idea how bad things will get. I am prepping, waiting and praying, which is all you can do.
Ragnarok
On and On, South of Heaven
For the last 104 pages, I've read the exact opposite...
Melodi,
I have started another thread for this, can we please, please, please take this type of discussion over there? Not only is it distracting here but comments are likely to get lost on this large a thread.
******** Thank you, Melodi! Hijacking this thread for a race related topic is not conducive to keeping informed on the spread of THIS virus now, in real time.
I have started another thread for this, can we please, please, please take this type of discussion over there? Not only is it distracting here but comments are likely to get lost on this large a thread.
******** Thank you, Melodi! Hijacking this thread for a race related topic is not conducive to keeping informed on the spread of THIS virus now, in real time.
Hfcomms
EN66iq
Thanks for sharing Blizzard....I was hoping you would stop by. This virus is nothing to 'sneeze' at pardon the pun and we better be taking it seriously as you being an in the loop ER Doc is. Things might be getting pretty dicey here in the next few weeks. To have foreknowledge is to be forearmed and that is what most of us are trying to do here. Take it seriously because it is!
Seeker22
Has No Life - Lives on TB
After reading some of the responses as per gene engineered virus, I am treating it as though it is until it can be proved otherwise. As I do not need Farcebook or Twatter to be my parental control, I read everything that comes across my screen and apply intellect to it in hopes that what comes after is something as close to the truth as I will ever find and prep according to that information.
I love my woo, as it is a release for me almost as fun as a science fiction novel. However, with my life literally at stake, I am not thrilled at the prospect of woo passing for hard science. Especially when some of it is passed out by professional news people who should know better. I am praying for China to finally be truthful, but I'm not holding my breath.
We all have ways to cope with what is coming at us, for some- woo works. Fear makes you crazy. Don't go there. Just don't. You have two choices: be crystal and shatter or be willow and bend to the changes. Those changes are coming fast and I fear we will not recognize this place in two months time. Be kind to each other. It matters.
I want to thank everyone who put something useful up. I have learned a lot and appreciate it.
I love my woo, as it is a release for me almost as fun as a science fiction novel. However, with my life literally at stake, I am not thrilled at the prospect of woo passing for hard science. Especially when some of it is passed out by professional news people who should know better. I am praying for China to finally be truthful, but I'm not holding my breath.
We all have ways to cope with what is coming at us, for some- woo works. Fear makes you crazy. Don't go there. Just don't. You have two choices: be crystal and shatter or be willow and bend to the changes. Those changes are coming fast and I fear we will not recognize this place in two months time. Be kind to each other. It matters.
I want to thank everyone who put something useful up. I have learned a lot and appreciate it.
adgal
Veteran Member
Thank you for this information!!!
Truthsearch
Doom is ALWAYS 6 Months Away...
there was a drone video purportedly of Wuhan.
I did not know Wuhan was that big, cosmopolitan, urban, six lane city streets.
Empty. Ever seen the movie "28 days later"?
Yea, That empty.
Zombie movie empty. Second coming empty. Totally freaking awesome empty.
Like no other virus ever before empty. Ebola is not this empty.
Global Warming is caused by man made CO2.
Weather is not caused by the Sun
A You Tube video caused Benghazi
The government is not going to tell you the truth
they are not going to protect you.
Fukeshima
Deepwater Horizon
I did not know Wuhan was that big, cosmopolitan, urban, six lane city streets.
Empty. Ever seen the movie "28 days later"?
Yea, That empty.
Zombie movie empty. Second coming empty. Totally freaking awesome empty.
Like no other virus ever before empty. Ebola is not this empty.
Global Warming is caused by man made CO2.
Weather is not caused by the Sun
A You Tube video caused Benghazi
The government is not going to tell you the truth
they are not going to protect you.
Fukeshima
Deepwater Horizon
SouthernBreeze
Has No Life - Lives on TB
I've also wondered about the slow down in news, today. I have no idea why.
bw
Fringe Ranger
Lack of news IS news.
Macgyver
Has No Life - Lives on TB
Heliobas Disciple
TB Fanatic
Exactly. That's why I bolded the text when I copied over the article. This has been my (consistent) complaint about how the US medical profession is viewing this disease. They need to get up to speed on transmission ASAP. There is no excuse for them being so far behind the data that is being released worldwide.
HD
Hfcomms
EN66iq
Because panic is even more contagious than the virus. The government is not going to tell you the absolute truth on anything and of course they think it's for your own good. If they are upfront and honest with what they know and what they probably don't know yet it would not engender confidence and survival of this present system is all about confidence.
What are you focused on specifically, if you don't mind me asking. I feel pretty well set prep-wise generally, including PPE for pandemics, but like to look/see what other top preppers are doing last-minute, in case I'd overlooked anything.
- Shane
Once you get past the morbid aspects the news from Bavaria is good. (Kinda) I have spent much time there and Bavaria is...mostly krauts. The chance of infection of additional Orientals there is minimal. I concur with the post Melody made above. Cannot bold names as I normally do. Different device, different location. I will correct my personal format later via edit.
bw
Fringe Ranger
We can't be more than a couple stories from the herd starting to move. More airport screenings have been announced. Masks are starting to become unremarkable. Once it starts, concern becomes panic in very short order, and empty stores follow about 90 minutes later.
bw
Fringe Ranger
You mean good as in we don't have to talk about race-targeted bio-weapons any longer? And "Kinda" because we're all suddenly in the deep end of the pool?