[POL] Open letter to the Red States

junerage

Contributing Member
a friend sent this to my email....

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I am writing this letter to the people in the red states in the middle
of the country -- the people who voted for George W. Bush. I am
writing this letter because I don't think we know each other.

So I'll make an introduction. I am a New Yorker who voted for John
Kerry. I used to live in California, and if I still lived there, I
would vote for Kerry. I used to live in Washington, DC, and if I still
lived there, I would vote for Kerry. Kerry won in all three of those
regions.

Maybe you want to know more about me. Or maybe not; maybe you think
you know me already. You think I am some anti-American anarchist
because I dislike George W. Bush. You think that I am immoral and
anti-family, because I support women's reproductive freedom and gay
rights. You think that I am dangerous, and even evil, because I do not
abide by your religious beliefs.

Maybe you are content to think that, to write me off as a "liberal" --
the dreaded "L" word -- and rejoice that your candidate has triumphed
over evil, immoral, anti-American, anti-family people like me. But
maybe you are still curious. So here goes: this is who I am.

I am a New Yorker. I was here, in my apartment downtown, on September
11th. I watched the Towers burn from the roof of my building. I went
inside so that I couldn't see them when they fell. I had friends who
were inside. I have a friend who still has nightmares about watching
people jump and fall from the Towers. He will never be the same. How
many people like him do you know? People that can't sit in a
restaurant without plotting an escape route, in case it blows up?

I am a worker. I work across the street from the Citigroup Center,
which the government told us is a "target" of terrorism. Later, we
found out they were relaying very old information, but it was already
too late. They had given me bad dreams again. The subway stop near my
office was crowded with bomb-sniffing dogs, policemen in heavy
protective gear, soldiers. Now, every time I enter or exit my office,
all of my possessions are X-rayed to make sure I don't have any
weapons. How often are you stopped by a soldier with a bomb-sniffing
dog outside your office?

I am a neighbor. I have a neighbor who is a 9/11 widow. She has two children. My husband does odd jobs for her now, like building bookshelves. Things her husband should do. He uses her husband's tools, and the two little girls tell him, "Those are our daddy's tools." How many 9/11 widows and orphans do you know? How often do you fill in for their dead loved ones?

I am a taxpayer. I worked my butt off to get where I did, and so did
my parents. My parents saved and borrowed and sent me to college. I
worked my way through graduate school. I won a full tuition
scholarship to law school. All for the privilege of working 2,600
hours last year. That works out to a 50 hour week, every week, without
any vacation days at all. I get to work by 9 am and rarely leave
before 9 pm. I eat dinner at my office much more often than I eat
dinner at home.

My husband and I paid over $70,000 in federal income tax last year. At
some point in the future, we will have to pay much more -- once this
country faces its deficit and the impossible burden of Social
Security. In fact, the areas of the country that supported Kerry --
New York, California, Illinois, Massachusetts - they are the financial
centers of the nation. They are the tax base of this country. How much
did you pay, Kansas? How much did you contribute to this government
you support, Alabama? How much of this war in Iraq did you pay for?

I am a liberal. The funny part is, liberals have this reputation for
living in Never-Neverland, being idealists, not being sensible. But
let me tell you how I see the world:

I see America as one nation in a world of nations. Therefore, I think
we should try to get along with other nations.

I see that gay people exist. Therefore, I think they should be allowed
to exist, and be treated the same as other people.

I see ways in which women are not allowed to control their own bodies.
Therefore, I think we should give women more control over their
bodies.

I see that people have awful diseases. Therefore, I think we should
enable scientists to try to cure them.

I see that we have a Constitution. Therefore, I think it should be upheld.

I see that there were no weapons of mass destruction in Iraq.
Therefore, I think that Iraq was not an imminent danger to me.

It seems so pragmatic to me. How do you see the world? Do you really
think voting against gay marriage will keep people from being gay?
Would you really prefer that people continue to die from Parkinson's
disease? Do you really not care about the Constitutional rights of
political detainees? Would you really have supported the war if you
knew the truth, or would you have wanted to spend more of our money on
health care, job training, terrorism preparedness?

I am an American. I have an American flag flying outside my home. I
love my home more than anything. I love that I grew up right outside
New York City. I first went to the Statue of Liberty with my 5th grade
class, and my mom and dad took me to the Empire State Building when I
was 8. I love taking the subway to Yankee Stadium. I loved living in
Washington DC and going on dates to the Lincoln Memorial. It is
because I love this country so much that I argue with my political
opponents as much I do.

I am not safe. I never feel safe. My in-laws live in a small town in
Ohio, and that town has received more federal funding, per capita, for
terrorism preparedness than New York City has. I take subways and
buses every day. I work in a skyscraper across the street from a
"target." I have emergency supplies and a spare pair of sneakers in my
desk, in case somethng happens while I'm at work. Do you? How many
times a month do you worry that your subway is going to blow up? When
you hear sirens on the street, do you run to the window to make sure
everything is okay? When you hear an airplane, do you flinch? Do you
dread beautiful, blue-skied September days? I don't know a single New
Yorker who doesn't spend the month of September on tip-toes,
superstitiously praying for rain so we don't have to relive that
beautiful, blue-skied day.

I am lonely. I feel that we, as a nation, have alienated all our
friends and further provoked our enemies. I feel unprotected. Most of
all I feel alienated from my fellow citizens, because I don't
understand what you are thinking. You voted for a man who started a
war in Iraq for no reason, against the wishes of the entire world. You
voted for a man whose lack of foresight and inability to plan has led
to massive insurgencies in Iraq, where weapons are disappearing into
the hands of terrorists. You voted for a man who let Osama Bin Laden
escape into the hills of Afghanistan so that he could start that war
in Iraq.

You voted for a man who doesn't want to let people love who they want
to love; doesn't want to let doctors cure their patients; doesn't want
to let women rule their destinies. I don't understand why you voted for this man. For me, it is not enough that he is personable; it is not enough that he seems like one of the guys. Why did you vote for him?

Why did you elect a man that lied to us in order to convince us to go
to war? (Ten years ago you were incensed when our president lied about
his sex life; you thought it was an impeachable offense.) Why did you
elect a leader who thinks that strength cannot include diplomacy or
international cooperaton? Why did you elect a man who did nothing
except run away and hide on September 11?

Most of all, I am terrified. I mean daily, I am afraid that I will not
survive this. I am afraid that I will lose my husband, that I will
never have children, that I will never grow old and watch the sunset
in a backyard of my own. I am afraid that my career -- which should
end with a triumphant and good-natured roast at a retirement party in
2035 -- will be cut short by an attack on me and my colleagues, as we
sit sending emails and making phone calls one ordinary afternoon.

Is your life at stake? Are you terrified?

I don't think you are. I don't think you realize what you have done.
And if anything happens to me or the people I love, I blame you. I
wanted you to know that.
 

Bearded Weirdo

Inactive
I'd like to see a follow-up letter from this lady in a few months (once the intial shock of seeing her candidate lose has worn off).

She seems to be intelligent, but she over simplifies everything. This clouds her vision, but again I think she is just despondant in seeing her candidate lose.
 

rafter

Since 1999
:bwl: poor me, I live in NY. :bwl:

The whole country should bow down and kiss my NY butt. :mn:

When are these people going to get over themselves.

And if/when there is another attack on some other part of the country, are they going to kiss their butts? I think not.

:kk2:
 

HeliumAvid

Too Tired to ReTire
I don't know how to talk to the Very Liberals....

Last night we were at a dinner party held by the daughter of wifey's dead husband's (not me I am still alive ;)) brother. She is Prinction/Berkeley Graduate, her bro went to yale... She could not get a paying job for many years after she graduated, but ended up marring a really rich guy and they live in a palace on a hill north of the Golden Gate. Liberal? Sheesh I just kept my mouth shut. I think having too much money makes folks insane... She wants more taxes... more welfare programs... more food at school programs. End the war... just pull out.. stop the killing... they will stop if we stop..

It went on and on... I just kept my mouth shut... Her Dad and step mom were there too along with my own step daughter and her latest bo (he has a periced touge... oh well) they are all of the liberal bent. It was bash on the red states night... I just drank my wine kept my mouth shut... Then I blerted out about some of the strange things that are "not terrorist attacks"... They had not heard of anything... Not even the train derailment in Brittan.. (at least that got about 5 lines on about page 6 in USA today with a comment it may have been a suicide (but not an attack;) ).

They did not understand we are at war. I brought up the concept that maybe we have had less attacks here because they are all busy fighting our troops in Iraq... What a concept! They had never even thought of that.... Sheessh..

It is hard when you are surrounded by the blue... They are ALWAYS Right..

And did you know that if you polled only people with college degrees that 75% voted for Kerry? and if you polled only those with advanced degrees 95% voted for Kerry...

I held my nose and did not bark... but I know a lot of silly valley friends with very advanced degrees.......... And they did NOT vote Blue... oh well...

I think the most interesting thing was when the daughter said something really outragous (I forget exactly what) I replied, "That is very PC of you." She replied, "What does "PC" mean?" I almost spit out my wine... No one at the table Knew what "PC" was..... :eek:

At least the dad was a libertarian, not a kerryan....

Saw a really interesting map.. The blue is small area, but very high numbers in those confined spaces...

I will be glad to get back home tonite...

Helium
 

CygnusXI

Inactive
I am a liberal. The funny part is, liberals have this reputation for
living in Never-Neverland, being idealists, not being sensible. But
let me tell you how I see the world:

I see America as one nation in a world of nations. Therefore, I think
we should try to get along with other nations.
We do try, bonehead. We have loans, trade, embassies, agreements on law and a whole host of "get along" policies.
Now, if you are saying that since some disagree with our morality and policies that we should comprimise our integrity, well then you sir are a dolt!


I see that gay people exist. Therefore, I think they should be allowed
to exist, and be treated the same as other people.
Uh.. they are allowed to exist, and they Uh.. are treated the same.
Now, if you are saying that America should trash century old traditions, and scrap the solid majorities will in regard to social acceptability for the appeasement of homosexuals on the psuedo civil rights BS, then you sir are a dolt!


I see ways in which women are not allowed to control their own bodies.
Therefore, I think we should give women more control over their
bodies.
What do you mean? More control over their bodies? America has a host of laws that make illegal the harming of ones own body. Drugs for instance. I could smoke Opium all day-- what concern is it to you, I'm just harming my own body?

This paragraph is too glib and moronic to really make a counterpoint, and the depth of the subject warrants an entire article, so I'll let this stand as-is.


I see that people have awful diseases. Therefore, I think we should
enable scientists to try to cure them.
LOL! Again! What? we DON'T "enable" scientists to cure them? In case you haven't noticed, and probably much to your shagrin, we live in a capitalistic society/nation. If there is a profit to be made--- scientists, and corporations are on it like flies on shit. If you are making a veiled reference to stem cell research, that sould be my case and point. The scientific community is cold to the idea, and winging taxpayer money at them to force dead-end science is foolish.

The Government is NOT preventing anything here. You need to learn the difference between enabling and preventing. The government is enabling scientists to find cures by allowing exploration and research. Funding is a wolly different matter, and arguably often a waste.


I see that we have a Constitution. Therefore, I think it should be upheld.
Ugh... the more I read I am convinved the writer is 12.
Look, the Constitution is being upheld. Some argue to the contrary, but as a matter of historic reference it is being held up much more today than it has been in the past. America has passed and revised the law of the land many times to right wrongs and enhance freedom, and it is a constant process.
No. We are not perfect, but making such a simplistic and lame statement as yours here shows your deep grasp of the obvious.



I see that there were no weapons of mass destruction in Iraq.
Therefore, I think that Iraq was not an imminent danger to me.
I'm sick of you. You make idiotic statements with the reasoning of a child and the feild of vision of a bat.
 

WitsEnd

Contributing Member
What kind of a bubble is this woman living in? She is so out of touch with the reality of my world it is hard to believe we are on the same planet. I wonder how many bombs or falling buildings it will take to get her head outta her butt! She has swallowed hook, line and sinker the whole propaganda line that has been planted and fertilized in most major universities for the past 30 years. Poor baby! She has paid $70,000 in taxes. Just what was her income? But then, with her law degree I'm sure she figured out a way to avoid the rest of the taxes she should have paid. And one more thing, when this woman says that other women should have more control over their body, I want her to tell me what crime the baby committed that he/she should receive capital punishment.
OK, I'll shut up now.

WE
 

bigwavedave

Deceased
She is so out of touch with the reality of my world it is hard to believe we are on the same planet.

um, i think that was the point of her rant?

where do you live, WE? can you answer the questions she posed?
 

mbo

Membership Revoked
uh huh

bigwavedave said:
She is so out of touch with the reality of my world it is hard to believe we are on the same planet.

um, i think that was the point of her rant?

where do you live, WE? can you answer the questions she posed?

Would you really prefer that people continue to die from Parkinson's
disease?


Yes, if it means that otherwise we will be using the fetuses of human beings, or making it more likely that abortions will occur for profit.

Do you really not care about the Constitutional rights of
political detainees?
Since the political detainees being held are NON-citizens, we don't believe they have Constutional rights.

Would you really have supported the war if you
knew the truth, or would you have wanted to spend more of our money on
health care, job training, terrorism preparedness?
If we knew the truth before the war we would have 20-20 vision. But we believe Bush, like Kerry, and Clinton before him, believed what they believed in good faith.

Oh and by the way, at least those of us who are not flaming left-wingers would NOT take money otherwise spent on the war and divert it into more socialist money pits.
 

Green

Paranoid in Los Angeles
Good post. A good example of normal thinking except perhaps for the oblique reference to support for gay marriage (dumb idea, guaranteed political death).

But then again, I’m a Blue Stater who drives a blue Ford. ;)
 
"...I don't think we know each other..."

Curious statement - I suspect that both sides knew all-too-much about the other...which contributed to the large voter turnout...and sizable plurality for the winning candidate.

Even more curious(er) is the fact that there really wasn't all that much difference between the two (major) candidates views on most key issues. OTH, there was a MONUMENTAL divide on other matters that clearly DID concern the majority of voters.

The 'blue' party will have to get beyond their whines, laments and complaints and figure out what the majority of voters WANT - and not simply pander to the the 'blue' party's increasingly out-of-step composite agenda.
 
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Bearded Weirdo

Inactive
I live in a solidly blue state so I guess I'm one of the "good guys", right? Pity the poor liberal who lives in Utah and is now considered one of the "ignorant red-staters". I guess they deserve the label though.


***NOTE TO THE ENLIGHTENED - This post was meant as sarcasm.
 

Lilbitsnana

On TB every waking moment
i wish that it wasn't always referred to as "Red State" or "Blue State". "Big City" vs "the rest of America" seems more like it. I have seen the maps that show how the states and counties voted, and those "Blue" states wouldn't be blue if it weren't for the extremely large metro areas.

Green, CA is a real good example. Did you know that LA county is surrounded by "Red" counties? How you or your county voted or thinks is not the "norm". The majority in your area, ok, but not the "norm" for the state.
BTW, I also drive a Ford. But it's Red.

Man, I thought it would get better once the election was over, no matter which way it went. More naive than I thought I was I guess. :shk:
 

Charlie

Membership Revoked
This letter is just more proof that living in a polluted environment (physically and mentally) does ROT YOUR BRAIN. :lol: Cities SUCK!
 

Aragona

Inactive
Rant against this liberal's logic

"I don't think you are. I don't think you realize what you have done.
And if anything happens to me or the people I love, I blame you. I
wanted you to know that."


I have so many issues with this arrogant liberal and her juvenile logic. The last paragraph irked me the most. She is blaming RED STATE voters for terrorism (only if it happens to her and her loved ones). Good grief, what does it take to get these liberals to understand thats what terrorists do - they KILL people. It's the terrorist stupid! DO NOT blame America!

I pray for your life too lady. I truly hope you live a long and happy life with many children and a prosperous career. I hope you get to write many open letters to the Red States about your fears and desires. I want you to survive.

And that is WHY I voted for GWB and thankful for our volunteer military who are taking action to defend us. Do not be afraid. Be brave, and let the adults handle the bad guys. Nobody is asking you for anything other than your support.
If you can't even do that, then my suggestion is to move to France or Canada where you will always be safe (sarcasm intended).

--aragona
 

Green

Paranoid in Los Angeles
Libit, here's the norm for the state, from the CA Sec of State website.


http://vote2004.ss.ca.gov/Returns/pres/00.htm

Kerry Democratic 5,652,020 54.6
Bush Republican 4,585,600 44.3
Peroutka American Independent 21,905 0.2
Cobb Green 33,059 0.3
Badnarik Libertarian 41,413 0.4
Peltier Peace & Freedom 22,435 0.2

I live in L.A. County (Santa Clarita Valley) and I work in municipal gov in Ventura County. Believe it or not, most of us wonks in the GOP administation I work in are Dems with the elected officials GOP (very moderate GOP's who are very ok to work for/with). Very sad day on the 3rd at City Hall.

The "Moral Values" was not a big deal for most local GOP's I work with (this is, afterall, hedonistic hot tub country, GOP and DEM alike). The big kicker seemed to be the tax angle as this is a VERY affluent area (Simi, TO, Westlake) with most local GOP's and DEM's argeeing on the sanctity of separation of church and state. Those GOP statewide candidates who try to run on a moral value issue in the primarys tend to get shot down in the general election, like Bill Simon (Bill who?) And moderate GOP's with cross party appeal like Arnold cannot usually make it through the primarys due to the more extreme GOP factions who insist on sticking to the "moral values" script. Big time political death in CA. If you recall, Arnold was ignored by the CA GOP establishment until 10 days before the recall election because he chose to be his own man, and still got elected notwithstanding the soft porn photo posted on Drudge. (I really like Arnold).

Still, the majority of the views in CA are, in fact, blue leaning. And with the line blurred between moderate GOP and conservative DEM, I still say blue thinking around these here parts is normal. That's why CA was posted blue, after all.

I had a Red Ford once. The cops really liked it. A little too much. :D
 

Breeta

Veteran Member
the part that really shows how unfeeling (or maybe out of touch) this woman (these women) is where she says: "I see ways in which women are not allowed to control their own bodies.
Therefore, I think we should give women more control over their
bodies."

As if pregnancy just happened out of the blue, for no reason. As if all pregnancy was a result of some man forcing themselves on the woman who had no choice at all in the matter! For christssake the rational these "women" use to kill their unborn baby is frightening! CONTROL THEIR OWN BODIES. Yeah, it's called controlling yourself by keeping your pants zipped, or knees crossed, or not having sex unless you're on BIRTH CONTROL and a condom is used. Choice and control is exercised before the child is conceived!! The only case I see argument for "control" of a woman's body is in the case of rape. Even then I don't think it's the best "choice" but a "self defense" argument can be made there so I think abortion should be allowed in the case of rape or life/death of the mother.

Ok. Rant over. :)
 

ejagno

Veteran Member
Everything I feel has been covered by most of the above posters so in an open letter to your friend please tell her to "Put your big girl panties on and deal with it." I'm sick of the election crap and most of all the threats of who will get blamed if anything goes wrong in the next 4 years. Grow up, change is the only thing in life that is consistent and we are all aware here in the RED states that change has and will take place as long as these terrorists are allowed to live and breathe amoung us. Just yesterday I read an article whereby two of Osama's main men are actually from Florida and California. So there ya have it! California is a blue state. Does this mean that we blame California if something happens? NOOOOOOO, American's don't turn their backs as you have on one another. We place the blame where it should be and that is with those who train, support and encourage the terrorism.
 

Lilbitsnana

On TB every waking moment
Green, I had been to that site before I ever posted. I even looked at the map and the county by county vote totals (as of 11:16 pm 11/05/04). Hence my post about the large metro areas.

I didn't/wouldn't have voted for Simon. And, I was a lifelong Dem (from the age of 18) til 11/21/03. If I move back to the midwest, I might become a registered Dem again. But I never let political party affiliation decide who I vote for (except the first time I voted, when I was young & dumb).
 

Trek

Inactive
Dear Fellow New Yorker,

I, too, live in New York. While I was wise enough to escape the day in and day out drudgery of city life, I still find myself missing the subway rides to Yankee Stadium, the Broadway shows, and the multi-cultural experience found no where but in New York City.

I am also a taxpayer. My husband and I also worked our butts off to get where we have, and to continue to move forward. I have family members who are gay, and while I disagree with their choice... I support them. I also am a woman, but made the choice to keep my child... and I thank my mother for raising me to fear God enough to make that decision, for I hear the pain in the hearts of other Mom's who at one point had made a different decision than I.

When a plane flies overhead, I look up. The news is on 24/7, and I am overly aware of my surroundings at all times. Plans are made, and reworked over and over again, to protect my family on the next 9/11, whatever date that day may fall upon in the future. There is no sense of safety. Only quiet preparedness and a hardened resolve to face our nation's enemies head on.

On 9/11, my life also changed forever. My husband returned home from work in shock to find that for the first time in ages I did not have the television on and tuned to NYC news. I turned on the news in disbelief only to face reality as I witnessed on television the second plane crashing into our lives that day.

Unlike too many that day, I did not freeze, stop to lick my wounds, or wail "Why???". I immediately gathered my children from thier schools bringing them home under my watch as I set up watch over the rest of our extended family. One by one, I tracked down my family and friends left behind in NYC. I praise God that my immediate family and friends were spared the horrible fate our fellow Americans suffered that day. Yet, my circle was not unaffected by the horrors put upon our great nation.

Too many of my neighbors lost immediate family. Some of my children's classmates were made orphans overnight. Still to this day, I can't go to the grocery store without running into someone who's face bears the pain of losing a loved one at the hands of terror.

I voted for President Bush. Right or wrong, he is not a man who will turn belly up to our enemies.

New Yorkers are known for their ability to handle anything. We are supposedly as tough as nails, and take no crap from anyone. Then I read a letter such as yours and I wonder. What happened to New Yorkers? Why are so many of them hiding their yellow streak under a banner of blue?

Even dogs know better than to stop and lick their wounds or turn their underside up to the enemy when under active attack. And, Fellow New Yorker... don't fool yourself. We remain under attack.
From the outside, and from within... through the weakness of the blue.

The next time our nation suffers casualties in our own land, I will blame the liberals. The same liberals that fight our nation's President every step of the way in this fight against terror. The same liberals our President tried to pacify by taking things slowly in Afghanistan, and now Iraq.

To hell with being "fair" as the liberals demand. The terrorists were not "fair" to us on 9/11, and we have been too slow and too light in our response.

The blame lay's at the feet of the liberal cowards obstructing justice for our nation.

Move to France already. Leave America to the strong!
 

Trek

Inactive
DH just asked "Whatever happened to that thread?". I told him I am fast becoming a thread killer. That's not true... right? You all just moved on to bigger issues, right?
 
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