SITUATIONAL AWARENESS 101

Apologies if this has been mentioned.
If you are in a mall or whatever during an attack and you want to fight back, consider a fire extinguisher.
They should be near an exit or in the exit tunnel path. Hold the valve in your strong hand, pull the pin, fire in the attackers face just long enough to blind or confuse him, step to the side, swing extinguisher at side of his head. Hit him again, get his weapon, hold it on him. It he tries to get up, shoot him. Be sure the cops don't think you are bad guy, keep an eye out for them, surrender immediately when confronted.
Just my $.02
 

Garryowen

Deceased
Apologies if this has been mentioned.
If you are in a mall or whatever during an attack and you want to fight back, consider a fire extinguisher.
They should be near an exit or in the exit tunnel path. Hold the valve in your strong hand, pull the pin, fire in the attackers face just long enough to blind or confuse him, step to the side, swing extinguisher at side of his head. Hit him again, get his weapon, hold it on him. It he tries to get up, shoot him. Be sure the cops don't think you are bad guy, keep an eye out for them, surrender immediately when confronted.
Just my $.02

Or, just fill his mouth with the dry chemical. If it's a CO2 extinguisher, you can his face into an ice cube. As long as he doesn't shoot you first.
 
My thought was to startle and confuse him, obstruct his vision, quickly move away from where you were as he tries to shoot you, then attack from side/behind. There will still be plenty of charge for a few more seconds for him or his accomplices.
 
New to this forum, and just read through this entire thread - a lot of good information! I was LE for over 22 years; wife thought (kinda still does) I was always paranoid when out & about in public, but I did beat it into our two kids (both early 20’s now…). At least some must have taken, as our daughter had a scary incident last year: she works at a bank, sometimes as receptionist. She noticed a guy in their entryway that looked out of place & gave her a “bad feeling”. Just before he came through the second set of doors into their lobby, she set the phone handset on her desk and dialed 911. The guy pulls a pistol out from under his jacket and points it at her for what she said seemed like “just short of forever” (a bit less than 10 seconds real time). She doesn’t make any sudden moves, but stands up (in preparation for moving or whatever else becomes necessary) and asks him if she can help him. He never speaks, then leaves. She picks up the handset and explains to dispatch what happened, there were already multiple units enroute. One of the three tellers saw the guy pointing the pistol, and she went & got the manager. PD arrives, and she gives them a very detailed description that got the guy nabbed within ten minutes (spotted by PD about to enter a nearby grocery store). After action, still don’t know what the motivation / goal was, but drug use was a factor. PD, her manager, & the other employees couldn’t believe how calm she was able to remain throughout the incident. Anyway, a very proud dad here!

Seeing something even a few seconds before the fertilizer hits the air handling unit can give you an advantage in dealing with it, so you’re at least somewhat proactive rather than being in full reactive mode.
 

Lone_Hawk

Resident Spook
New to this forum, and just read through this entire thread - a lot of good information! I was LE for over 22 years; wife thought (kinda still does) I was always paranoid when out & about in public, but I did beat it into our two kids (both early 20’s now…). At least some must have taken, as our daughter had a scary incident last year: she works at a bank, sometimes as receptionist. She noticed a guy in their entryway that looked out of place & gave her a “bad feeling”. Just before he came through the second set of doors into their lobby, she set the phone handset on her desk and dialed 911. The guy pulls a pistol out from under his jacket and points it at her for what she said seemed like “just short of forever” (a bit less than 10 seconds real time). She doesn’t make any sudden moves, but stands up (in preparation for moving or whatever else becomes necessary) and asks him if she can help him. He never speaks, then leaves. She picks up the handset and explains to dispatch what happened, there were already multiple units enroute. One of the three tellers saw the guy pointing the pistol, and she went & got the manager. PD arrives, and she gives them a very detailed description that got the guy nabbed within ten minutes (spotted by PD about to enter a nearby grocery store). After action, still don’t know what the motivation / goal was, but drug use was a factor. PD, her manager, & the other employees couldn’t believe how calm she was able to remain throughout the incident. Anyway, a very proud dad here!

Seeing something even a few seconds before the fertilizer hits the air handling unit can give you an advantage in dealing with it, so you’re at least somewhat proactive rather than being in full reactive mode.

Good for your daughter. Funny how her non-reaction reaction to the perp is probably what threw him off and why he walked out without doing anything.
 

L.A.B.

Goodness before greatness.
And missing the most in this thread is the advice of the one who started it!

^^^SPOT ON^^^ medic38572. She seems to have been very busy for the last run around the sun and some change.

I’m going to drop a link here to a young man named John who is ex-mil of some sort, and just very smooth common sense shooter.

Here is his .02 cents on Situational Awareness. It dovetails with my hands on system of avoid or dominate. Something I have practiced for over two score.

John, The YouTuber is a proponent of The Late Col. Jeff Cooper. I was a kid in high school when I first learned of Col. Cooper’s trademark SA system. I took it a step further with extreme men’s intuition, and that with Col. Coopers ‘Scout Rifle Concept’ helped me save my fathers life from a confrontation in the So-Cal desert in 2003.

Situational awareness allows you to dominate if you have too. Situation awareness is only an edge if you can transition from the wide eyed baby doe, to the hungry tiger at the snap of a twig without the fear or anger of an adrenaline dump. Just do it. Just do the minimum necessary without ego only looking for the effect of breaking contact, or dominating.

Here is John’s link: John, The Warrior Poet Society.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=0G1H3DpN44s

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=bHq4dbQBa14

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=TPHqgvXkENg
 
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L.A.B.

Goodness before greatness.
Great words, MAC! I've had vision problems for the past 2 years and finally had the surgery last week and can see again...

<3 MAC

Maureen, I am happy to read that you’re sight is better. Staying good becomes a primary chore as the years tick by. Stay warm & well this Christmas and New Year; and may God’s blessings be upon you and yours in the coming years.

Stay healthy MAC!
 

seraphima

Veteran Member
i was travelling recently, and noticed how many of the people around me were absorbed in their cell phones. In the car rental area of Anchorage airport there were about 80 people; five of us appeared alert, and not on a phone: one child, two men at either end of the large area, one car rental agent, and me, an old lady. Phones can be addictive, and like any other addiction, this sure shuts down situational awareness. Never mind those driving a lethal weapon (car) and texting or talking.
 

MaureenO

Another Infidel
And missing the most in this thread is the advice of the one who started it!

Medic, time and duties.

I recently posted a new thread in the BS which was closed due to a RTP. My post referred to an undenied yet unconfirmed set of shooting threats to schools in 2 US states on 28 and 29 August. My principal reason for posting the thread was to point out the SO's response which was to suspend the sheriff's employee who breached protocol by posting the threats to Facebook in an effort to warn parents. This will not be a rare response in future. One TB member got what I was saying.
 

L.A.B.

Goodness before greatness.
We have some of those, but the reason is that during the summer months it's hard to sleep when the morning sun is blazing into the room. With modern tech, blackout curtains wouldn't make much difference in an air raid. I'd guess, and it's only a guess, that most of them are bought by night shift workers.

Light discipline...

One valid bare bones reason to manage light output is to avoid the beacon call of ‘come to my home in the middle of the night because I have electricity and possible frozen food’ for a little longer one week into the power outage.

I do half of my driving in the dark. I take note of all the lights I can see in living room windows at elevation several miles away. In a JIT Seizure (JITS) <—my ACRONYM, these beacons will invite the uninvited.

Probably best suited for use by people who live off the beaten paths. That tank full of wanderers scavenging the light-scape at all cost.

ETA: Maureen’s post highlights the info-war of managed chaos. The three letters who chastised the Country Siren’s for “leaking” what should have been a forthright warning lend themselves to becoming the meme’rs for the next wave of Pavlov-Hegel Gun Control.

Beware of the prepackaged over-response to managed crisis. Tyranny by the dots.
 
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MaureenO

Another Infidel
Light discipline...

One valid bare bones reason to manage light output is to avoid the beacon call of ‘come to my home in the middle of the night because I have electricity and possible frozen food’ for a little longer one week into the power outage.

I do half of my driving in the dark. I take note of all the lights I can see in living room windows at elevation several miles away. In a JIT Seizure (JITS) <—my ACRONYM, these beacons will invite the uninvited.

Probably best suited for use by people who live off the beaten paths. That tank full of wanderers scavenging the light-scape at all cost.

ETA: Maureen’s post highlights the info-war of managed chaos. The three letters who chastised the Country Siren’s for “leaking” what should have been a forthright warning lend themselves to becoming the meme’rs for the next wave of Pavlov-Hegel Gun Control.

Beware of the prepackaged over-response to managed crisis. Tyranny by the dots.

Spot on, MAC.
 

coalcracker

Veteran Member
Had an interesting situation the other night. After an event in a small city, I was walking my daughter (30 yr old) to her car which was parked 2 blocks down a side street from where the event was held. I was parked on a different street, and would walk there after my daughter was safely in her car.

My backward glance noticed a teenager moving toward us from behind on the sidewalk at a fast pace. I then noticed a second teenager on the sidewalk on the opposite side of the street also moving toward us with the same fast pace. Clearly, not normal situation. It was 10 PM and no vehicular traffic was on the dimly lit side street at the time.

I calmly told my daughter (who didn't see them coming) to go to her car and I'd see her later. I then turned around and walked out to the middle of the street, some distance from daughter's car where I stood and faced both teens who were now getting close. My right hand was noticeably positioned for action, and I had eyes on both.

Can't say what their intent was or what they were thinking, but they just kept walking right on by. Can't even say they knew each other.

Reminder: the most vulnerable position is when you are rushed at the door of your vehicle as you're entering. Females especially. Perp can take control of your car. You cannot allow that to happen. Keep potential perps guessing which car is yours. If you think you are possibly being followed, circle back to the store/gas station/venue. It'll only cost you a few minutes. Change the dynamic of the situation. Make it non-linear. Throw the predator off.
 

srb6101

Leading the charge without any help.
Im curious why threads die when even more than 10 years later the issues in them are still the same?
 

srb6101

Leading the charge without any help.
These are all so good. Thanks everyone. I've picked up some good points here.
Was talking to a cousin out west last night, and the topic of the upcoming anniversary of 9-11 came up. She mentioned she's been nervous about flying ever since, I said that whenever the sound of a plane is heard overhead I STILL think of that day, and she was so surprised, she said, "You too?! I thought I was the only one who was still antsy about hearing the sound of a plane overhead!"

Now this is us, in Canada...relatively safe and out of harm's way and not anywhere NEAR New York or Washington.

So I got to wondering how you guys in the USA cope each day...HOW on earth can some of you have forgotten....
and do you all think we will EVER go back to normal times, days of yore when the sound of an airplane made you think of the drone of a bumblebee on a lazy summer day, and not of other things.
WILL we ever have a normal, peaceful world again, (short of Jesus Christ's return that is???)

It is easy to tell you how most people have forgotten,

Instead of having us watch the news clips about it all the time, they removed it as fast as they could saying it was too traumatizing to be left showing.

After a few years people started forgetting so they no longer cared about it unless the event was a personal thing.

Sure, they do a "remembrance" ceremony, but after 20 years, who really watches it or pays attention any longer to them? unless it was a loved one who died.

All the Government really cared about was ramming a 1200 page bill through to 'protect' us. aka take away our freedoms.

and they are still at it years later.
 

33dInd

Veteran Member
Me thinks this will be another bad year
Went to the range yesterday for some pistol time with my police department. Though retired I still interact
The rank and file are all talking about the disrespect they are getting
Stuff thrown at their cars

The general feeling of strong dislike held in check
Mostly black but a number of whites to

Goi g to range again today for some rifle time
 

nomifyle

TB Fanatic
One the one hand I notice things, but on the other hand I just do normal stuff, like going blindly into a store. I don't get out much but it only takes one time.

God is good all the time

Judy
 

Siskiyoumom

Veteran Member
I reread this thread.

Lately I have been complacent and not as security minded as in the past.

Last night was very hot, still 100 F at midnight. Being so far out in the sticks at a dead end mike long driveway, off of a rarely trafficked forest service road means we hardly ever get visitors late at night.

I happened to get up to tend to a very full bladder, as I sat on the toilet in the dark house a bright light shines in through the sliding glass door and into the bathroom mid stream.

I think wow, that is weird! I quickly finish up start calling out to dear hubby who is sound asleep and he does not waken.

I go out to the porch and a large crew cab truck pulls in.

Hubby had parked his tractor but the front porch and our two rigs were parked by the house.

I yell out who the f are you looking for?

A fella replies we are lost. Does this road go to the highway?

I yell to him no! He says he was following the map he had.

I told him he messed up and gave him the directions to get back up the mountain to the main stem forest service road, tell him how to look for landmarks to stay on it and how many miles it takes to get to the highway.

It took him five minutes to do a fifteen point turn around to face the outgoing direction.

His rig was so big he tore up my iris bed by backing repeatedly over it.

I had to yell at him to stop a couple times because he almost ended up in the creek. Whew!

As they finally were turned around a female called out “Thank you for not shooting us!”

Once they were gone I woke up hubby who was surprised about the late night wanderers.

The shorty is now back out by the door and accessible.

I want to add a bright motion sensor yard light. I am glad nothing bad happened to us.

The only other late night wanderer was a class A motor home following GPS and the driver insisted our drive way went all the way to the highway.
 

srb6101

Leading the charge without any help.
I reread this thread.

Lately I have been complacent and not as security minded as in the past.

Last night was very hot, still 100 F at midnight. Being so far out in the sticks at a dead end mike long driveway, off of a rarely trafficked forest service road means we hardly ever get visitors late at night.

I happened to get up to tend to a very full bladder, as I sat on the toilet in the dark house a bright light shines in through the sliding glass door and into the bathroom mid stream.

I think wow, that is weird! I quickly finish up start calling out to dear hubby who is sound asleep and he does not waken.

I go out to the porch and a large crew cab truck pulls in.

Hubby had parked his tractor but the front porch and our two rigs were parked by the house.

I yell out who the f are you looking for?

A fella replies we are lost. Does this road go to the highway?

I yell to him no! He says he was following the map he had.

I told him he messed up and gave him the directions to get back up the mountain to the main stem forest service road, tell him how to look for landmarks to stay on it and how many miles it takes to get to the highway.

It took him five minutes to do a fifteen point turn around to face the outgoing direction.

His rig was so big he tore up my iris bed by backing repeatedly over it.

I had to yell at him to stop a couple times because he almost ended up in the creek. Whew!

As they finally were turned around a female called out “Thank you for not shooting us!”

Once they were gone I woke up hubby who was surprised about the late night wanderers.

The shorty is now back out by the door and accessible.

I want to add a bright motion sensor yard light. I am glad nothing bad happened to us.

The only other late night wanderer was a class A motor home following GPS and the driver insisted our drive way went all the way to the highway.

Is the road an exclusive road to your property?

Perhaps a fat thick chain across the boundary of your property like might be needed, as well as a few dead end signs.

It seems that somewhere a GPS map company decided the road does go to the highway.

srb6101
 

Siskiyoumom

Veteran Member
Is the road an exclusive road to your property?

Perhaps a fat thick chain across the boundary of your property like might be needed, as well as a few dead end signs.

It seems that somewhere a GPS map company decided the road does go to the highway.

srb6101
We having a logging chain gate at our property edge, and a forest service gate at the top of the forest service road.
 

Siskiyoumom

Veteran Member
We having a logging chain gate at our property edge, and a forest service gate at the top of the forest service road.
Over summer we had an active wild fire near our home. We were asked to keep the two gates open in order for access from the fire fighters. We were ordered to evacuate due the close proximity of the wild fire and very real danger of the fire reaching us.
Once the fire turned away from the property and the road rehabilitation being completed we were able to start locking the gates again.
 

srb6101

Leading the charge without any help.
Dont know if it made news anyplace else but a group of about 80 people deliberately blocked roads to a mall in order to rob stores in the mall without getting caught. it definatly had to have been organized. this was the week before thanksgiving. other than tha ti havent really heard much else about unrest.
 

NoDandy

Has No Life - Lives on TB
I reread this thread.

Lately I have been complacent and not as security minded as in the past.

Last night was very hot, still 100 F at midnight. Being so far out in the sticks at a dead end mike long driveway, off of a rarely trafficked forest service road means we hardly ever get visitors late at night.

I happened to get up to tend to a very full bladder, as I sat on the toilet in the dark house a bright light shines in through the sliding glass door and into the bathroom mid stream.

I think wow, that is weird! I quickly finish up start calling out to dear hubby who is sound asleep and he does not waken.

I go out to the porch and a large crew cab truck pulls in.

Hubby had parked his tractor but the front porch and our two rigs were parked by the house.

I yell out who the f are you looking for?

A fella replies we are lost. Does this road go to the highway?

I yell to him no! He says he was following the map he had.

I told him he messed up and gave him the directions to get back up the mountain to the main stem forest service road, tell him how to look for landmarks to stay on it and how many miles it takes to get to the highway.

It took him five minutes to do a fifteen point turn around to face the outgoing direction.

His rig was so big he tore up my iris bed by backing repeatedly over it.

I had to yell at him to stop a couple times because he almost ended up in the creek. Whew!

As they finally were turned around a female called out “Thank you for not shooting us!”

Once they were gone I woke up hubby who was surprised about the late night wanderers.

The shorty is now back out by the door and accessible.

I want to add a bright motion sensor yard light. I am glad nothing bad happened to us.

The only other late night wanderer was a class A motor home following GPS and the driver insisted our drive way went all the way to the highway.
Glad nothing bad happened to you. +1 on the motion sensor light. May I suggest, add a bright light on your shot gun, and a sidesaddle with spare shells.
 

Griz3752

Retired, practising Curmudgeon
Glad nothing bad happened to you. +1 on the motion sensor light. May I suggest, add a bright light on your shot gun, and a sidesaddle with spare shells.
Another vote for the gunlite & sidesaddle, depending on range and how much area your yard light exposes to you.
Might consider an AR instead depending on the range and if you've got some distance (over 250 yds) maybe an AR25
 

NoDandy

Has No Life - Lives on TB
Another vote for the gunlite & sidesaddle, depending on range and how much area your yard light exposes to you.
Might consider an AR instead depending on the range and if you've got some distance (over 250 yds) maybe an AR25
I agree with the .30 cal. .30 cal is always good, especially for longer ranges. I still like a shotty for closer work. .30 cal offers a number of choices, Garrand, FN 49, FN-FAL, M1-A, HK, CETME, Armalite, and various Russian arms. Obviously, some better than others. The Cetme would be my last choice

You mention the AR25. I assume you are referring the Knights Armament SR-25. I have handled some, but never fired one. They are obviously very well made. One I handled was owned by a KSP State Trooper. He was a very skilled / experienced rifleman. His was the 24" heavy bbl match version.
He informed me that it was unquestionably the most accurate rifle he had ever shot. He even claimed it produced several 4 shot groups with all holes touching, at 100 yards. He was using Federal Gold Medal match king 168 gr HPBT, with Leupold Mark 4 LR Tactical glass. Coming from this man, I put high credibility on his claims.

I would love to have such a rifle, but sadly, it is way beyond my budget range ! I will have to rely on my Rem 700 .308, or my modified Springfield .30-06 . Both of those are very accurate, just not as quick on follow ups.
If you have one, you are L U C K Y !!!

But, I can dream !!

Regards

:ld:
 
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